RE: SPS Proposal - SPS.DAO should stake an additional 28,000,000 SPS for a total of 30,000,000 SPS
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I like it @genepoolchlrn8r and I will vote for it. I think the Staked SPS holders should start to realize they are ALL "owners of the DAO". Just like with all assets a person manages, they should always want to grow those assets.
I think some people might not want to see this pass because they might feel their own current rewards will drop. But imo that's short term thinking and also indicates they don't think they feel the DAO assets are their own.
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i must be thinking short term cause i don't think this is the way.
If a bank told me that i was gunna lose 6% interest from my personal savings account but don't worry cause you have shares in the bank and you vote what the bank does with it so it's all good...... EDIT: i really don't follow this line of thinking.
Hey @michealb ... I'm not sure what you don't like about it, but this is the part that I feel is important.
I think there is a general lack of appreciation that we collectively own the assets of the DAO. The SPS in the DAO is controlled by the SPS stakers and would be in stronger hands.
That's why I think we should also want as much SPS in the DAO as we can possibly obtain. Its also why I want to buy RFW packs for 100 SPS each and soak up 200m SPS (or more than 20% of the outstanding).
In essence, the more SPS the DAO has the stronger the staked SPS holders are. Its our SPS in aggregate.
One day in the not so long term, we will cross the threshold where the amount of new SPS minted is insignificant relative to what we already own (collectively and also as individuals). Its at that point when people realize the benefit to owning SPS is real.
In order to get SPS, people are going to have to work much harder for it or invest more money on their cards to compete; or they will have to buy it. It won't be as easy as it is right now.
I think people like you and I have been here for a long time and have a big vision for the opportunity SPL has, and thus we won't want to give away our SPS for small pennies. Thus the more SPS that is held by long term hodlers (and by extension the DAO they collectively control), the less that would be able to be sold for such small pennies.
Like any market, the price will ultimately reflect the equilibrium between the buyers and the sellers.
So if we have lots of players that understand that SPS is hard to get but want it because it holds lots of assets (300m SPS +++), and at the same time have lots of staked SPS holders that value their SPS for many multiples of these prices because they see the potential; then equilibrium would be much much higher than the few pennies we trade for right now.
While this proposal, or even my idea for selling RFW packs for 100 SPS, won't make that magically happen overnight; what they should start to do is educate the community to the benefits of the DAO owning more and more SPS.
The more the DAO owns, the higher % each Staked SPS holder owns and the less SPS floating in the market sitting in weak hands.
Once SPL gets DEC to peg and the flywheel they keep talking about starts for real, then people will be able to picture the impact more clearly. The flywheel will work, but it will work much faster and be more powerful if the SPS is owned by stronger hands that believe the price should be many multiples higher.
Sorry for the long winded explanation, but I wanted to give you the respect of a good answer.
ps... let me know if you still support a proposal to sell Riftwatcher packs for a flat 100 SPS per pack.
You edited your message, I answered a lot of it above. But here's and additional answer:
you are viewing the bank's assets as a third party where you will not see any economic benefit (you only get to instruct them on how to spend their money).
I would argue the DAO is part of your personal assets because the value of the DAO will be embedded in the price of your SPS.
SPS has at most 3 billion issued (less now after nodes/RFW packs). The DAO already owns 300 million SPS (+ what comes in from nodes/RFW packs). That's 10%+ already, not counting past and future sales of nodes/RFW packs.
If the DAO gets another 200 million SPS just from RFW sales, then it will be over 500m SPS. That's the numerator.
For the denominator, in addition to the DAO holding say 500m of the 3B in SPS or 16.6%; the whole flywheel model Matt is implementing is designed to BURN SPS.
Example A:
500m
_____ = 16.6%
3b
Every year they will issue more things to be sold in DEC. That DEC will have to come from burning SPS. So each year the denominator will go down, but our numerator will stay the same or go up with earnings.
Lets say they sell just one mini set per year along the lines of RFW... 3 million packs at $5 each. That's $15m worth of DEC or 300m burned SPS at an average of 5c. So now the equation looks like this:
Example B:
500m
_____ = 18.5%
2.7b
Rinse and repeat each year. Also don't forget to include all the DEC that will be needed for other things too.
How does this affect each staked SPS holder?
There are 3 ways:
NOTE on #3: while this is nowhere close to even being on the radar, the point is the assets are OWNED by the staked SPS holders and can be distributed however the community of SPS stakeholders votes. Obviously collectively we would all decide what is the best thing to do, and the same voting rules would apply so it would have to be more than a majority to make this type of decision.
Hope this helps you to understand my thinking.
Dave your response is hard for me to dissect.
I'm all for the DAO making $ - it should! i just don't like the way this proposal wants the DAO to make money. It competes for ROI directly against all those who lock up funds (already with a diminishing return) so they can vote on proposals such as this.
If you gain some momentum with 100 SPS for Riftwatcher packs i will vote - yes. I haven't really thought about that one too much.
edit: Might not have much staked SPS left to vote with if you keep lowering the return though hahaha
edit 2: your 'short term thinking...' sentence triggered me, so i apologies for my edited first response
From a pure investment perspective (where I as the investor want the best yield for myself no matter what else happens around me), the DAO SPS is not liquid (unless we vote to spend it on something like buying DEC for the LPs etc).
So, this proposal removes liquid SPS from the market. It puts it into the hands of an entity that won't sell it.
If the market cap of SPS is $100 million dollars and there are 100 million SPS, then your SPS is worth $1.
The price of SPS is determined based on the demand for the liquid tradeable SPS.
If the DAO (through initiatives like this one) gets 50 million SPS in the scenario above and the demand for SPS remains constant, the price of SPS will go up roughly 100% because people still need it to do other things, but there is 100% less of it around to trade.
And the best part for that scenario is that those of us with the 50,000,000 SPS are all partial owners of the DAO SPS too. It's ours to decide what to do with in the future.
Of that 6% SPS from the staking rewards that the DAO will be accumulating if this proposal passes, most of it will go to the largest stakeholders currently and hopefully they have the game's long term interests at heart, but a decent percentage of it will go to people who don't have SPS long term interests at heart and are just chasing yield to sell SPS for whatever the next shiny thing is.
We know the DAO will always prioritize what it thinks is best for SPS.
Micheal, I'm sorry for triggering you with that comment. You are (and have been) one of the most positive members of the game from the beginning. I meant no disrespect to you (or anyone), and I realize now I should've worded it better.
I understand how you see it and I will think of how I can explain it better.
I certainly don't think this is a proposal that should make you want to sell, I have a lot of SPS myself and I'm not a proponent of "lowering the return" in any way. In fact, my goal with anything that I propose (or vote for) is to make SPS stronger and more valuable. To me that's how we attract and retain players for the future.
Again sorry for triggering you and I hope you have a great day!!! :)