SPS Governance Proposal - Adjust Rewards Based on Card Level
A proposal is being put forth to a vote of all staked SPS token holders to adjust the amount of reward shares awarded in ranked battles based on the level of cards used by the winning player in the battle.
The goal of this change is to encourage players to own and/or rent higher level cards and encourage combining cards by reducing the amount of reward shares earned by cards used in battles that are below the intended levels for each league.
Initially the concept of collection power was introduced in an attempt to ensure that players would need the appropriate level cards in order to participate in higher leagues; however, that system was relatively easy to work around and we are still seeing many players that are able to earn full rewards in higher leagues using low level cards.
With the recent changes to the ranked reward system, we now have the tools to better achieve this goal by limiting rewards based on the cards actually used in the battles rather than cards simply sitting in players' collections.
The table below details the proposed minimum level of cards of each rarity required to earn full rewards at each league.
| League | Common | Rare | Epic | Legendary |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Bronze | 1 | 1 | 1 | 1 |
| Silver | 3 | 2 | 2 | 1 |
| Gold | 5 | 4 | 3 | 2 |
| Diamond | 8 | 6 | 5 | 3 |
| Champion | MAX | MAX | MAX | MAX |
With this change, the reward shares calculation for each ranked battle win will be adjusted by the average of the level of each card used by the winning team in the battle compared to the minimum reward level for that card and for the player's current league as indicated in the table above.
There are a few important things to note about this proposed change:
- Any level of card is still able to be played in all leagues, it's just that cards played below the minimum level for the rarity and league will reduce the number of reward shares earned for that battle
- Cards played above the minimum level for the rarity and league will not increase the rewards that can be earned, nor will they be able to "make up" for reductions from other cards that are below the minimum level
- The level of card used will be for the actual card and not based on summoner level. For example, if a player is using a level 1 Obsidian and a level 5 Goblin Psychic then the Goblin Psychic will still be counted as a level 5 card for the reward shares calculation
- Starter cards will count as level 0
The following examples illustrate how the proposed change would affect reward shares earned under different scenarios:
Example 1
A player in Silver league wins a ranked battle with the following cards:
- Level 5 Common
- Level 1 Common
- Level 1 Rare
- Level 1 Legendary
The reward shares earned by this player will be roughly 70% of the total that they could have earned had they used higher level cards which is calculated as follows:
Example 2
A player in Gold league wins a ranked battle with the following cards:
- Starter Common
- Level 1 Common
- Level 1 Rare
- Level 1 Rare
- Level 1 Epic
The reward shares earned by this player will be roughly 20% of the total that they could have earned had they used higher level cards which is calculated as follows:
Ultimately, the Splinterlands team believes that this change will go a long way towards preventing some of the workarounds that some players are using in order to earn large amounts of rewards with cheap, low-level cards and should help encourage more card combining and provide more value to owning and renting higher level cards going forward.
I don't know. To me it just seems like yet another market manipulation in favor of early adopters at the expense of new players. I can't see how this trend will lead to anything but a closed silo of faithful players, inaccessible and unattractive to anybody not currently well invested.
That's ONLY if you are thinking of wild format... once Untamed gets bumped out of modern int0 wild, any new player will be able to cycle in using current edition cards. This has nothing to do with early adaptors vs. new players.
Oh cool. Then just make this apply only to modern.
Good thing i bought 10000 packs lol
This has EVERYTHING to do with early adopters vs new players.
Every rule that's changed ends up benefiting early adopters who, by sheer luck, purchased lots of 0.01$ cards that are now worth 250$ each. They can bulldoze their way by purchasing everything that's released and leveling everything to max just by selling 2 or 3 Llamas that they're hiding under their sleeves for the last 2 years.
While new players have to either bring 10k USD to the game, or be relegated to bronze rewards even if they're actually playing the game better (eg with more skill) than old players.
Not by luck always they recognized the potential and waited year then yes great returns as they shoudl
I think you can't build a system that incentivizes increased ownership, leveling, etc... without also rewarding early adopters.
The modern/wild format goes a long way to help even the playing field for new players though. Each new edition release gives players a new shot to have the exact same change/buying power as long as they stay invested (which is the behavior we want to encourage).
The issue isn't so much about rewarding early adopters but hurting new players. A system such as this raises the stakes for new players forcing them to pay more in order to play. The end result is that they won't play.
It doesn't force them to pay more to play - it forces them to pay more to earn more.
That would be fine if the game wasn't still widely promoted as #playtoearn. The beginning levels are really competitive already. The easy way out is to rent. There is already a market manipulation in place which requires a new player to rent or buy in order to earn anything. There is another market manipulation in place that requires a player to rent for 2 days in order to rent any card. The end result is that this is a PAY-to-earn system and we're asking new players to pay a lot.
Get a archmage let it go for 6 days enjoy diamond
Don't you see the mistake? You recommend a bot, but the game should be so much fun that you want to play it yourself. a game that isn't worth playing will die! the balance between play and investment is completely out of whack. would you buy stock in a game developer who only makes crap games that no one wants to play?
cant play all day
neeed to earn all day
simmple
Not a mistake why not bot when you cant play
Play to Earn doesn't mean Play for Free, or Earn the same regardless of what you pay.
We're asking new players to Pay a Lot to Earn a Lot - that seems fine to me.
This game has always said that they want to be a blend of Invest more to earn more + More skill to earn more - not one or the other.
Yeah, it seems to be 90-10 split in favor of paying more vs skill.
ETA: this change seems to be more of an admonishment of skill rather than a reward for investment. That's just my perception.
Yeah - I think I'd agree with that assessment, though I don't know if it's the intention.
Sometimes to squash exploits you squash honest people doing honest things in the process.
Accounts are flooding battles with low level cards in an unskilled way and that might be the bigger impact than the accounts that are using low level cards to higher skilled impact.
The good news is that a decrease in rewards on an individual battle that you're winning may still work out in a players favor - because increase in rating is a bigger lever on increased rewards than most other things in the game.
If you have this skill you should be able to wipe the floor with my account when its botted when i cant play. someone please warn me if anyone is passing proposal to basically destroy my earnings which go into my project which will be much more beneficial to new players. It takes moeny to do these things and I need to dump my in vestment if i can no longer accomplish what Im trying to do and it actually is for new players and expanding the game so not all ppl who bot with not shit accounts are bad. You should be able to compete with them if your good
Or grind it out the free way harder now but AB days much easier
They will if the rewards are worth it. I borrowed money not that i Need to but its more efficient for my ROI. I take risk maybe if ppl did that they could have a higher level deck and compete. There are ppl that can kick my ass with a lower level deck when its botted. So maybe need a bit more practice or buy a bot to so you play while your not able to but I need to this is what i do.
We get rewarded
with the node drop , glx drop as older player slike me tend to hhave more sps giving more drops and nodes
early adopters should be rewareded
to a extent not damanging but none thats bs
Early adopters should still be rewarded and so should u
Yes early adopters should be rewarded but they should be rewarded through success of the product not through market manipulation.
Agree but also if there are drops based on assets that should be fine bc they held those assets thereis a opp cost for me to put over 100K in and i hsould get a return.
to get a competitive account use the resources buy a bot u can get a b for 200 ish my b took me in diamond 1 and is playing there now sucking in chests. I did spend 30K on cards for it. So i think bots that havre a x spend or cardd level should never be penalized
I think if your bot can't beat a real player using lower level cards, you're not being penalized, you're just losing. And honestly, you kind of deserve it.
So the starter card penalty would be lifted as it's already included in that level calculation?
double penalty :)
good
Here's the problem I see:
Right now we are losing players because they feel the game decision makers (big players and devs) don't really care about the new and/or smaller players.
Changes like this are probably ok, but it seems to me like we want to do everything BUT think about what the new player faces. For instance:
First and most importantly, a new player has to face over 100k automated bots that have been programmed to have the perfect teams in the bronze and silver levels for each of our rulesets and mana caps. Unless a person has some insight as to some work arounds, they simply have no fun getting their brains beat in day in and day out.
Secondly, these automated bots ONLY EXIST because they get FREE cards to play. These aren't new accounts, these are accounts that have been opened for many months (and in some cases years), but THEY DON'T HAVE TO OWN/RENT THE CARDS that they play. They simply rent the key cards necessary to milk the system, and do it by relying heavily on the free cards to do so.
In other words, if you took away the starter cards for all accounts after an introductory period, then a substantial portion of those 100K+ accounts would either 1) cease to exist or 2) have to rent/own.
These 2 things affect the game for new players in the following ways:
Gameplay at the low level is not fun, and in order to rise above this unnecessary hurdle a player must decide to spend many hundreds of dollars to build an adequate deck. So enabling these 100k bots to have FREE CARDS to play and stomp in the lower leagues, not only ruins the small player experience, it take a massive amount of their earnings (see below).
Because a bronze and silver player must share their earnings with these 100k+ accounts, their earnings have be destroyed. I would suggest that there is probably 50 to 100 bots for each human in those leagues. This is a massive hit to the "little guy's" earnings from playing. Just like larger players think large players should make their fair share, little players feel the same too. The same frustration is applicable.
For a game that suggests (rightly) that you should own your assets to earn from the game, it seems like this concept is being lost when it comes to the little guy. It seems like little players don't matter. While I know better and know that the DEVs do care, the appearance is terrible.
I have made this point before and I can tell you the first reaction: The nerfs put in already have made the bots not use the starter cards since they don't earn on them. If this were true, which isn't, then removing the starter cards would have no negative impact. In other words, what is the point of having them after an introductory period?
Summary
While I like the game trying to always improve the way in which rewards are given out, I HATE when the game neglects a segment of our community. If someone has been here for more than an introductory period, they should own or rent the cards they play. PERIOD.
While people can debate if my solution would work or not relative to chasing away the bots, one thing is clear. All changes to rewards at this point mean nothing to the little players, they will continue to feel that they stand no chance and aren't listened to as long as their competition gets FREE CARDS to both steal their rewards and beat the shit out of them.
I love this game, I think the team truly cares about everyone. But I think they've lost touch with what the smaller players feel and should put much more thought into this issue. The community was built for all size players, and I don't think its possible to grow much larger without getting back to those roots.
Please help people and not bots.
Yes, the new player experience is 100% an area that needs a lot of focus and we're currently looking at the data on starter cards and how we can address the issues there.
That's all completely separate from this particular proposed change though. This is just about making sure that players to own or rent the appropriate assets in order to be able to earn the rewards for them.
thank you Matt!
For new player experience, have you considered creating a ghost league with progression to earn new ghost cards the more you play the game? This will allow new players to really experience the game for what it is than worrying about how much money they should spend to compete in ranked games? Of course ghost league will not earn you anything.
This is already possible to some degree, I believe. If you don't buy a Summoner's Spellbook, you can play the game, but you won't earn rewards.
It doesn't allow you to experience climbing the leagues with the changes in abilities, though.
Yes correct!
Agreed.
It could if it used the same leagues and ranking system as the main game does though
the ghost league will allow you to use max level cards unlike in the ranked league ghost cards, you can only use level 1. There should still be progression in this league to earn the max level ghost cards or other ghost cards on diff levels. This is the only way majority of players can experience the game to its fullest potential.
Ok, that's an interesting idea. And I think it would be beneficial for new players because the gameplay is more entertaining at higher levels and they can only experience the lower leagues in ranked battles and may think the game isn't fun at all.
This is going to be possible with the new open tournaments (although there is a 20SPS entry fee) https://splinterlands.com/?p=tournament&id=a9cceda6e3921f65baef72a14a9e66cd8d28c534
20 sps doesnt seem like it would be a issue at thewe prides
Where are the rewards coming from sure as hell not from the current things there would need to be some sort of new way no way sps should be involved rewarding or very small amoutn.
What about a SPT rental market place where rents are determined by stske left for me to vote with and would need a formula as well as incentives if they rent a lot it will ower cost and be locked for a month. I get my votes i want.
If I have "No Melee"-Ruleset I need a chicken with Level 1 (By the way: Why can't I use my Max-Level-Chicken at Level 1 - this update was promised a long time ago), so when I put this in future in my team this will cut my rewards ?
no wonder i never see it
Hoping to help with my project and the many guilds were building for new players and then still have details to work out but having NFty manage it will free up my time to do that thank god for them lol I would be shot if i had to manage it.
Boting is not bad if you put resources and the intent to use those to help and profit. mine are not exploiting they have between the two average it 30K a piece
Good @bcarolan639 ... I agree as well... my criticism is about the free cards (starter cards) that enable hundreds of thousands of accounts to take rewards (both SPS and reward cards). If those accounts rented or owned the same cards then I would not have an issue with them.
Good job to help others too, that is very nice to hear!!!
I actually own a small part of the shares so benefiting all sides is in my interest
Not the dao own that to but i got in during the seed round luckily but that puts me in a position to see it from all sides
iagree with that
Im trying I want this shit and GLS to kill it i own stock as well as the dao so I have a large chunk of change in this and the only way to grow is bring in new ppl and help as well as it will make me money not as much but plenty since i just bought the 10K packs or 50000 cards to fund decks to play
I'm with you. I think that's the plan with the new projects SPL is doing, bringing in more players to increase awareness and attract more gamers. And if they do that then we both will do really well! :)
100% get rid of those
100% they need to go
Same here not a issue if you spent the money to bot at a high level
Nice, I like that introductory period thingy.
Honestly, what needs to happen too is draining the players rating slowly when they don't have the required CP (or Power). That is a huge RED FLAG for people double dipping.
So if they don't have the 'Power' for that league then each day their rating is reduced, and helps the active players push past them.
Yes agree completely @just2random
I like it makes me more moeny in higher leauge and pushes rents up
I would support the no hibernation proposal :)
Just seems lazy to do that
You should 100% be able to earn passive income 24/7 if you invest in the account i have thousands and would need to dump alot of card if something like that were passed bc i dont have all day to play everysecond but i need the moeny to support my projects and with 90-100K plus invested I should be able to get rewards for that. Its called investing
low power shit bots make it hard but mine plays in diamond 1 all the time so with out those alot of games are hard to find bc ppl cant play all day and work on projects for the game to like i do
Fair enough bcarloan curious where you are on the SPS DEC proposal now actually
i voted yes for this one
Makes sense I kind of like combo packs so hope they all pass :)
I changed my 580K sps to vote yes so hope it does i read it all wrong before
Ya i always have combined and i know it makes them worth less right away but winning has made up for that
I want dec to get slammed down for a bit and i dont care if sps is lower bc of it give me time to accumulate lol once im at like 2-3 million then im ready for these lol I think i voted for SPS rewards bc it will lower the price letting me buy more and against anything that pushes up dec because i neeed a bit to buy at a discount and flipping large numbers of packs to get airdrops is pretty profitable. Tryingto buiild a war chest before shit ineveitabley goes up whe nthe other games come to be fully operationsl
Im thinking long term for me i can with stand sps hiting a cent id be buying millons as ppl dump it same with cards now im buying a crap load of them no one understands that the demand will come back as long as ppl play the game which seems to be doing fine based on my share value as well in the stock i own to. I have almost no preference bc i win no matter what with all sides of the game. Unless this company dies which with what there doing now doubt it.
read it all wrong lol
Wow, this is a fabulous idea! This would also even out the rental market. It's not unreasonable to expect players (or bots) to maintain a consistent deck throughout the season in order to reap the leaderboard rewards. That looks plain ugly anyhow, I don't see a downside to ratings decay mechanism.
That sounds fine and agreat idea
Dave for President!
lol :D
I'd say that the problem with removing starters after an introductory period is that it doesn't allow for someone trying the game briefly then coming back at a later point, only to find they can't do anything because the starters have all gone. Even if you did it as the starters going after a certain amount of games it wouldn't take into account various development speeds. I recall when I started losing hand over fist as I tried to figure things out. It was only because I was lent some cards by Matt Clarke and got the odd reward card that I actually started getting anywhere. That's how slow a learner I am. 😆 I'd do better today if I had to start over, but that's a few years of experience behind me.
I agree that is an issue to consider @minismallholding , I have suggested that instead of time being the determinant for their removal, instead make it x amount of charges for each card. So for instance you can use each card 100, 200, 500, xxx times, then it will go away. If you did that then you could also give them popups to let them know that they can rent the card on the market when its getting ready to be used up. To me this would make the most sense, because we want people to try the cards and then if they like them, they can either buy or rent them in the future.
and Matt Clarke will go in the hall of fame for all he's done for the game :D
Why not charge sps and give it to the dao
So your saying decaying cards not liking the sound of that at all. a hard no from me if i am understanding it
THIS. I don't even need to right a direct reply for the article, you covered nearly everything. Great job! I'm going to stop my unstaking just to vote this bs down ;)
In my opinion Splinterlands think since a long time not to the small player anymore, they aren't interested in them, the time is over when somebody who spent 500$ or 1000$ in the game is worth something.
They showed it again and clear with the promotion for Splinterfest, the smallest package was 4000 packs for 4$ = 16.000$ and if you buy the biggest pack for 160.000$ you got 40-times more SPTD packs than with 16.000$, additional bonus packs (with this promotion) you got also only in the more expensive package.
I don't understand why it is not possible to make also a package for 500$ or 1000$ - the only answer I have is that they don't care about such people with such "small" amounts.
So this is IMO the real problem.
100% in agreement, a lot big players see that issue as well. We need new players. Period! And currently I do not see a lot that attracts new folks.
The problem is the game is not competitive at all. If all cards would have the same stats and level up means only " more rewards" it would be the pro gaming scene.
But what we see is money = higher rank means the game is meaningless to compare it to skill.
If you have zero investment or skill you wont nake money
only investment needed + time.
Does take skill to play and win money there
IM a large player with a project that im doing that will focus on bringing new ppl in and getting them in brawls to build up guilds and accounts they can later earn or buy based on there profitability and time with the guild.
Pretty much, I sold 90% of my account in the last year or so cos I don't like the direction things are going and it makes me think it's all just a waste. I mean who wants to play a game with 50 people with max everything and 100k bots.
You can beat my bot prob pretty easily if yo uhave the leveled cards to do it.
There is loook at the purchases in the store 100 = 400 or less with dec, 500 - 2000 or half with dec theres your thousand an 4000 with dec on the last one seems like its covered
I spoke from the promotion for Splinterfest, this is on top to the normal bonus packs (who aren't free - they need one voucher). To take part in the promotion for Splinterfest you need to buy 4.000 packs for 16.000.000 DECs. Even this packet is very poor if you compare with the paket for 40.000 Packs for 160.000 DECs, if you spent 10-times more you get 40-times more SPTD-Packs, 10% additional bonus packs, more potions & runis.
So IMO you see clear the splinterlands-management is only interested in big investors, they obvisiouly even not thought that their can be people who want (or can) spent only 500$ or 1000$ - This is the point.
I haave to disagree i am a big investor now but I wasnt at all times when i first bought in they still let me even though it was not the most profitable for them since legal costs compared to proceeds but they still let me in and have taken care of my concerns and requests when i only had a few grand in in it now i have quite a bit more but still nothing has changed for me. Let them do what they do and i bet it comes out good.
I think alot of ppl are not really seeing the whole thing and are freaking out bc were in a period where earnings are less if you are using this to earn money for a job you needd a pretty big account and accounts botted a24/7 and played in tournaments plus brawls s well as own the promo items like runis for rewards drops and varous air drops like GLX very improtant in my opinion bc you here them talking baout all the shit they are going to do with the games and if ppl can just wait like i waited a while before when i played al long time ago. Right now take advantage of low prices bc no one has much money im about to buy a bumch of cheap ass cards
When ppls earnigns go down they dont think straight unless you have dealt with this stuff alot
Can pool with ppl to do large purchases
yes you can pool but you cannot share what you get, f.e. potions aren't transferable, so you cannot share them with the member of your pool. So one have the potions to open all packs and other have packs without potions.
Also it is a question of trust to make a pool as in the end the account-owner can just keep all and sent you nothing.
So I think it would be much easier to just allow to buy small packages.
Not if your a group and partners you just put it in the treasury account and are group will be big enough to do this.
Thats why i did buy the 25K package myself i got all the airdrops. I get like 70 airdrop cards now and with the end cards approaching they will be valued the most probably have like 5-10 K in drops which pays for half of my purcahse almost to.
Nice for you, but not everybody can buy 25k packs ...
I borrowed money on a zero percent credit card like i do every year to flip the packs and use others money for free, this year I used about 150K and used it to lease out in LP pools for stable coins mostly then some went in my brokerage like 30K so i could trade on margin on the margin i had. I didnt get my wealth by not taking any risk. I also have a significant investment in splinterlands including a large SPS, GLX, NODES, LAND, Common Stock in Steemmonsters Corp, large card collection so I have quite a bit of risk and possible reward. I get most cant afford this stuff but should anyone who invested early suffer and lose bc ppl cant figure out how to win and make money? I started grinding with absolutly no outside money and it was a 50K account in 2 years so it can be done you just need to really want to do it just like anything else that 90% fail at. Now im almost at the point maybe 1 million more sps and 200-500K sps then ill start sucking in stable coin pairs to create a annuity to use to buy more gaming assets in games like illuvium and other cryptos.
If you are so well, why you can't get others a upvote instead of yourself ?
I mean it is not that I beg for votes but to reply and give only a upvote to your reply show me what guy you are - sorry to say this.
Its purely numbers and using the same content on hive and steam as well as like 10 other sites that give u money then use a AI writer to plow out high quality content based on the best performing articles on each platform. Do text to audio and video on all video sites, translate to all languages that are active, audio and text, use posh for twitter, post on all traditional social media and direct ppl to the referral site which will show them how to get a splinterlands and hive account and then do the first 20 referral codes for bank accounts and get 2000 plus i get 2000 and then they can use that to fund there decks and I end up with a whole lot of money. I have a group of ppl ready to test it and try all of them which will let me get prob 40-50K per person if they get hat far but its like 020 ppl so even if they do the no brainer easy ones to get 2-3K ill get 40-60K just from that lol its so easy to do never tried at this scale but showing how it can get ppl assets for free in the the game will also give me X% of any credits spent so i get a piece of there referral to and any other money spent and will be handing out my referral code with a card for each person and pay them half of the credits in dec and ill use the credits to buy cards and flip or rent. Getting the gladious cards and soul bound for a bunch of accounts is the most important and i have the sps to do it when that comes so why not why wouldnt i as a investor in more ways than one not play this from a money making angle. Its just what im here for is to start a investment club funded by votes and vote capital raises where ppl vote and that translates to there equity pro rata once converted to busd or something. Once i get he funding site up to where ppl can do the bonuses then get a 20% bonus from my cut it all is invested in the club which will give us more funds and eventually will have hopefully a tone of money under management but not over like 100 million if we ever get that high since larger funds cant move money very nimbly or take advantage of this bottom feeding stock strategy i use all the time lol on the micro sctocks with my 1100 dollar robinhood account i mess around with last year made 1700 on 300 my brokerage statement had sales proceees of half a million thats how mucch i traded back and forth to make 2 k lol. It was what i did when i was wallking aaround or randomly remembered but some how i did good for the year lol. Once i get this fund running with my own money thats already in my acounts im goiongto raise the seed capital then probably wait for more performance and go to raise reg A up to 50 million and see how much we can get to manage and ecpand to new things oter than games to. Also will get a nice management fee and promoted interest for as long as the fund is in business so deff gong to make sure everything is seemless to get ppl onboarded to the club and the capital funding for the club and there deck as well so they an play in are guilds and level them up for us and we sell the guilds later with or with out accounts. A 10-20% royalty on every accouny applies so we get money and keep getting a stream that grows when mmore are sold. Also will be working on tokenixing a mazzive guild that the dao will elect the players to play the numner of guilds we will have so they can stream and play 24/7 like bots but will make the offer to give the best players much more rewards than others wwould so its pretty easy to get the ppl and then can try with new players give them the opportunity with a lower split to play a new guild and for each new member we get they will prob play 1/4 of a guild using accounts we own so we get all cards. Then the players will get upvotes if they reblog etc and vote back since the whole point for a investment club is to find strategies to make money. I found plenty thta will be pretty profitable now just need to make the new accounts and all the managment ones and its ready to go for the seed round and maybe well end up getting more than i think using tribevest herd good things. Hopefully we can make the minimum in the reg A like 50 dollars so everyone on hive can be involved at some level if they twant to.
Dosnt show just shows i use my capital the way i choose. I choose to allocate to my projct. yes i can have a slew of ppl upvote all getting the same if i did or they did so really does not matter votes go the same place author and reward plus steem same and 20 other chains. Will be funding for 6 months to create a start of what will be a usefuly token to replace SPT with cash flow or give us control to burn most of it in treasury lower vote limit and reimburse costs and return the rest evenly toanyone less than 1000 hive. Also have to build pre made frays for ppl no one has cards for it. SO were doing something. I dont care if you think its stupid were helping ppl with this and ive already moved the operation and its not dedectable now so itsl ike any other cartel token u guys let just do what they want but u can vote me in this acount when the hive comes in dont expenct freindly treatment from my group which will be alarge alliance by then with a huge amount of vote power enought to stop you by just re voting every down vote. and giving the ma bonus 2-4 votes. and keep groowing it so we cnat be bullyed agian for using are money they way we want and my content not the point what im doing with it is. So if your thing prevents good things how is it something we need. LIke i wonder how much i need to buy to just be bale to have a big influance on who does this stuff and propose removal of down votes or take the teeth off them. Addd funding for the club which will goto each person who claims there basica token allocation then there will be a miner auction and a seed round. If were not at 500K with that and the votes we will add a revenue share 50% cf for 2 years up to 2X and 3% equity. Then a sba loan 1-7 million for a building to make the first rent free and weed apt complex catored to gamers in NY only other ganaga hotel in co im a shareholder its a big tihing and gmaers lover weed.
if my reply vote gives me moeny why would i not if my opjective is raising mony
Think about games similar do like magic ppl have millon dollar collections plus the company has given away essentially profit for ppl who have listened I mean I have a stake in the DAO and the company so im in both sides of the earning fence so the company needs moeny to pay the devs and aeveryone plus produce a roi for unit holders which i have no complaints about. Watched this game develope over the years not once have i been concerned yes we have bull and bear markets , yes may be to risky for some but i thrive on risk and being able to manage it making good trades and setting up systems t osuck out rewards from steem and bring to hive lol.
But what have this to do with the question if you value small investors or even if you value investors at all ?
I don't know how many player / investors took part in the Splinterfest-promotion, but when I see the shop-page and see how many packs needed till next airdrop it seems for me that it wasn't really much.
The question is f.e. if it is better to collect from 2 investors (this is only a example as I don't know the real participants) 160.000$ = 320.000$ pr from 1000 investers 500$ or 1000$ each = between 500.000 and 1.000.000.
But I can also ask other question:
They could but that thats like 2k if thats to much just split it with ppl thats what we did with a 100k poool.
Just need more than one person easy
The game is simply heading in the wrong direction, no new players would be attracted by this, not gameplay nor rewards.
And we need new people and also keep old ones interested that leave already, a clear no to this proposal and any other changes that is purely intended to influence money and reward part. Maybe a cool gameplay attracts newbies?
@uwelang I agree very much about the perceived direction (that isn't necessarily their intent though) and about the retention issues. I've spoken directly with @yabapmatt about these issues in particular. He has promised that it is high on his priority list. While there are no single fixes (there are many steps needed to be taken), I think Matt is on it. I do trust that when Matt puts his mind to something, then he will make it happen in a way that we are all impressed!
I don't think we have to vote "no" on this proposal to be heard though, Matt says clearly this is just one step he's taking with many more to come.
I made my bet on the team years ago and i have not seen a change in there approach and if anything this game has improved 10X so im very happy to have bought units in the game and the DAO units so i get GLX tokens and Nodes
I still would just owuld need a bit more money now maybe 5K to get started wit ha collection owned but I have a partner who rents and kills it
IM doing a project ot help with that in guilds but there is just no way hihg level rewards can ever be cmpared to a new player who spent no money yet. I barely made anything i grinded alll day bc i likeed it lol Now havea lot of cards and capital so i can ahve nfty set up 8K packs for chaos optimized decks for rentals and splits if we make 10 on all 1500 accounts we get 15K a day plus EOS and Brawls as well as 100% of bot rewards to earn merits and sps during the day or night.
I agree 100% with this analysis and think the starter card issue needs to be addressed ASAP. It's not being given enough attention for how important of an issue it really is. My wife enjoyed the game but quit playing after a few weeks because of how awful the new player experience really is.
This really, really needs to be given top priority. And it's an easy fix!! 30 days and starter cards go away. Or a set of 'charges' per card aaaaand... they're gone. This is LONG overdue, especially when you consider the tremendous impact of this particular bot exploit.
The bots are not designed to beat your deck IF you actually use max level cards for the league you are playing in. This results in more people renting cards like I do and using the highest levels for each card which I have never had a problem beating the bots since I don't just play nonstop to pick random cards and "hope" to win. That is how people are abusing the rewards right now and if you stake SPS, this shouldn't even question the proposal here as it is a no brainer.
This proposal sounds good as long as it does not impact all the ppl who bot with say two 45k acccounts
It will help my bot win more since mine is playing high level so im goood
Good ideas! I would also like to add on this. In order to make the bots go away, let's separate everyone who has those free cards into a "Free League", which is basically same as the normal leagues, but without rewards. It doesn't serve anyone to have bots playing for rewards.
I like that idea @gamer00 !!!
yes free but not bots who have 90K in the game
Not in thousands of accounts but betwen like 3
Its a way we earn a roi 24/7 and are able to support things with that money there is no way that having a bot account with thousands of dollars of cards is exploiting
Yes and do not impact investors who put money into the bots like serious money
No it actually does they give ppl games to play now im talking about botsthat have a high amount of investment not shit bots like if you play mine it will be a challenge in diamond or champion no way bots should be banned many will wait like a hour for a match.
maybe a tiney amount to get ppl to play with no money
pretty small
I agreee for no investment but fuck no fo ppl who have hig level bots with alot of money and have fun finding any game to play
I like your idea. I play a whole lot less these days because it is not worth the massive amounts of time it would take to even begin to make this rewarding. I'm trying out brawls to see if I can at least bring back the fun.
Thats wehre my project is focusing on making higher level guilds accessible by leveling them on a large scale for ppl who are new to playin like reservedf spots not for older players as much. I want to build them up get them strong accounts then give them the purchase option to buy out the account with gladious cards that we would own until then.
I get to diamond one in like less than a day in wild
doesn't seem right to me.
@scrubs24 made a nice suggestion. It should work both ways. Give a bonus if you have max lvl cards for the league.
and dont penalize bots with actual serious incestmetn
I have two 30K avg each
Liek that makes sense
I think that if a player (or should we nowadays say "the bot of a player"?) is skillful enough to succeed in a certain league, they should also be able to earn the rewards promised by this league. Actually, if someone with cards of a lower level reaches the same rating like a player with cards of higher levels that is an indicator that they play the game rather well. I see no reason to punish good players.
Yes, I see a huge problem caused by bots, but in my opinion to 'punish' skillful players is not the solution of that problem.
Furthermore, some cards are simply not much better on higher than on lower levels (think at the chicken), and therefore I see no reason to put artificial pressure on uplevelling every single card.
The thing is that the reality has nothing to do with skill. It's just accounts with level 1 cards playing against other accounts with level 1 cards over and over and slowly but surely moving up the leagues.
Rewards need to be based on a combination of skill and assets. Skill will lead to a higher win rate which is one of the biggest factors in the amount of rewards, but for the assets part all we really had was collection power which is too easily manipulatable.
This aims to fix the asset part of things. If you want to earn the rewards, you have to have the cards. This will be a huge benefit to the entire ecosystem and everyone who owns assets in it.
Yes, in lower leagues that might be correct.
In higher leagues I can talk for myself: as I am using a pure gold foil account I cannot max all cards because that is simply too expensive (maybe for non GF accounts that's somewhat easier). However, I can use some near max level cards quite effective (also some cards like the chicken or the albatross don't even require high levels at all to be very helpful) and normally always reach Champion II. In that case (at least if played manually) I call that skills.
I wouldn't consider that change to be "terrible" but I am not convinced it to have an overall positive effect (I might think about it again, though).
Yes you're right that it's different in higher leagues vs lower leagues. In higher leagues it's much more skill-based and this particular issue is mostly found in the lower leagues.
Overall though, the general concept here is to require more assets to earn the max potential rewards. So the fact that some cards like the chicken don't require high levels is a bad thing in my opinion - there should always be benefits for leveling up cards, so this mechanism helps to provide that. Now there will be more reason to level up those cards.
For gold foil cards, I think typically the GF card bonus will outweigh the reduction from this change, so they will still be a net positive in most cases, and also hopefully this will provide more incentive for them to be purchased/rented even at the high prices.
Nice to see that you take the time to answer to questions and concerns so thoroughly!
As you are 'here' I take the opportunity to let you know what is my only real worry concerning the future of Splinterlands (I think all other problems should be anyhow solvable). I fear that bots will completely dominate the game sooner or later (and to a certain degree already do, even in the highest leagues - you might ask @jacekw for confirmation).
I wrote about that topic here, but since then the problem even increased.
I understand that the philosophy of blockchain and decentralization makes it difficult to take any effective measures against bot dominance.
I also know the view point of the Splinterlands team to be 'bot agnostic'.
Nevertheless, I would really apreciate you to read my bot post in case your time allows it.
(Of course then you could also answer in Discord instead of on chain if you prefer that.)
I read your post and I agree with you about bots. If they can beat chess and go they can beat Splinterlands (which is currently much simpler than chess or go). I have two comments on that:
The plan is to make the game more and more involved with more player input over time. I know it's still a while out, but the item and spell cards that are part of the land expansion are a good example of that. That type of thing will increase the complexity for bots by many orders of magnitude and hopefully give human players a big advantage, at least for a while, by which time hopefully we can add even more things to the game. The advantage we have over chess or go is that chess and go don't change and add new features, but Splinterlands does (it's just been very slow, but will be getting faster).
I'm not sure it's necessarily a bad thing if bots are ultimately better than human players. Many people will still just enjoy playing the game and they will be matched up against opponents at a similar skill level - especially as the game grows and there are more players at all levels. So at the highest levels people may use bots and compete on the best bot software (which is also kind of cool), and then at other levels human players can compete against other players (whether bot or human) at their skill level so they can enjoy the game and work on improving. So I'm not sure that it's necessarily bad or good - it's just different and has its own pros and cons.
Nice reply!
The first part sounds promising.
Concerning the second part:
Yes, actually, I am also fascinated by some chess programs, 'masterpieces' of software and (partly) AI.
And I also respect people who will write better and better Splinterlands bots in future (yes, that's indeed also "cool"). :)
A pure bot championship would be actually fascinating, too: who is able to write the best, most sophisticated Splinterlands bot? In chess there are competitions only for software ...
Especially in chess, bots are great tools to practice one's skills, analysing games and learning to understand chess better.
(Interesting also for Splinterlands could be the idea that some chess programs are having certain modes in which they intentionally don't always play the best possible move to make the games against human opponents more exciting and variable.)
However, one difference is that in chess (or GO) in (human) tournaments and public servers bots are strictly forbidden. That means human players are never forced to play against a bot if they don't want. They can intentionally challenge a chess program (if they really think they would be able to beat 'God') :-) or just practice with it, but in human tournaments they can be sure to face human opponents only.
Concerning Splinterlands that could mean, there could be different kinds of competitions in future, for example "bot only", "human only" and "mixed". Then at least everybody would have a choice. And I know very well that even if 'we' would try to implement these different kinds of tournaments it would be very difficult to verify that a 'human' is really a 'human'.
I agree tournaments and guild brawls no bots is cool but a high investment account should be able to earn all day in normal battles for ranked rewards and i dont make as much if i were to actually play it all day but i come back to play when im in the leauge i want i dont want to sit thought the lower leauges when i want to work on my guild project to help ppl get into the game plus make some money with it to. Like i cant do that with out my high level bots, There will be alot of things that dissapear if those go away like get banned not if they become obsolete then i neeed to deal with it and find another way
Why should anybody play themselves, if bots do the same without wasting time and energy? In the end with this vision Splinterlands might become an inhabited ghost town where bots play against bots. A pure staking mechanism but no game anymore.
If the daily games are too many for a human, just make them less.
You also don't tell a soccer player like Lionel Messi to play 5 soccer games per day. :)
Create conditions within the game which humans can fulfil.
I wrote a longer post about it some time ago.
There not i can play beter and have a better win rate but when im not playing i want more money with my level of investment in the game im a investor first now but also a player bc i like it which is why i invested in the company in the first place in 2019.
Yes, we are all investors (I am also one since 2018), but in my opinion long term every investor earns most if the game is developing well and attracts as many as possible satisfied new players.
And the big majority of human players prefers to play against other humans ...
100% why im dong what im doing with my project to grow it
On point 1 and 2
Would it make more sense to wait for land to implement then propose this change?
Depending on how far land is from implementation it could be factored in then.
On the first point, would it be a good idea to commit to something like 1 new ruleset per month? And maybe deprecate some older ones in favor of newer ones after a while to not make it super complicated for the human players after a while.
That should give bots a hard time keeping up. The question is, would we tolerate the rapid changes better, as humans?
And a bot say like mine with a lot of cards and power will be able to compete while i cant play and give ppl a opponentin diamond and champ
But doesn't it really just punish you for not having a leveled up card rather than rewarding you for having it? Meaning will the rewards for a given league increase from where it is now?
Punishing vs rewarding in these cases are really just a matter of perspective. Yes, players using lower level cards will get less than they received previously if this change goes into effect, but really they were getting more than is sustainable for their cards in the past and it's just being "fixed" now.
But from the general perspective - not comparing it to a flawed previous system - the higher level your cards, the more rewards you earn - so you are rewarded for getting higher level cards.
Thanks for the reply. What aspect is unsustainable? Is it the rewards paid out or is it fluctuations in the card market?
Its acceptible to have two bots with significant cp right i just want to stay on the same page as the message going out from everyone. Also my bots will partially be used to onboard players etc so i see that as a possitive effect of it and lets me earn while i do that stuff. Not doing the bs level one lol mine are maxed or close.
I thought the fixed pool of rewards ensured sustainability, but I'm interested in learning why that is not the case, meaning we need to implement something like this. I love learning, so thanks for your insightful responses!
In general a good idea.
What if:
All cards have the same starts from Level 1 to Max,
Skill becomes more skillbased,
Only rewards change.
Level 1 no rewards,
level Max = max rewards.
That would be a very drastic change, but would remove bots, special if the curve would be right.
Now the question would be, are investors sad or happy with it?
I mean on the other hand "delegate cards" would be for example for the best to earn.
What would be the reason to earn?
Yeah here everything becomes difficult :D
Was a spontan idea, but maybe something like this ( less drastic) could be a thing.
I would agree level one
but the top tier levels diamond to champ shouldnt be so drastic but deff have a incentive to do it. And where can i go to try and get SPTs vote lowered other than buying half the SPT lol 20 million is crazy. I can get it but no one else can and the cartel controls it all.
play with high level cards could access the rewards chests,
i mean at some point the walls are to high for new players and the game will die.
The game has not the "fun factor" of a high class game. So it needs to be a competitive game.
If this becomes impossible to be,
what game is it at the end?
Pay to play to earn?
I get diamond with the bot arch a and b they cost 30 to 1000 for a but if you used a 30 at work you will come home to earnings ppl need to be able to let it play 24/7 and games would dry up.
In higher leagues it is part of the fun in the game and skill of the player to craft your deck in a cost effective way. This proposal will remove that. May I suggest to remove the champ limit or make it less impactful by for example giving 1 or 2 cards per match that are exempt at diamond / champ because in the current system we see no low level farming at champ so there is no reason to solve anything. To put this proposal as a blanket over all leagues will take away a fun element of the game, and reduce the influence of skill/knowledge of the player.
You cant play 24/7 and I like to earn 24/7 im a investor and player removing my ability to earn 24/7 will not be good for many players alot will dissapear then you have no one developing or creating a large project like im doing bc they cant fund it and if you cant beat my bot then the skill is not there. Im better than my bot but im working 20 hours a day on my project i think i deserve a bit of pay.
I agree the botting to leech rewards needs to stop with bots that have not invested its not a suck rewards from ppl investing in the game free for all lol.
GF were cheap last i looked
But the easiest way if in your budget is but alot of cards lol. I know it cant be done always
In general it is simple, make the game more complex + add random factors.
For now it is a bot game, and i see no reason why this would change.
The most simple thing would be to "disvalue" low-effort bots with an additional layer of complexity.
With this change in place, it could also remove the general MMR system and use the cards for access.
Why wasting time in lower leagues with higher level cards?
You match the cards, you can join the league.
As long as it doesnt efffect equipt bots like mine with 10-30K in them
Like that skip the leauge to your leauge
I totally agree, but if thats the case maybe bring back guaranteed elements for every match or something. Cuz now its just really expensive to play Splinterlands at the level that you want to play at, compared to the past (or you just get a lower ROI, which doesn't matter, except it does a little bit).
Ya i agree should have something to keep ppl who jsut cant seem to get there maybe a group who is voluntiered to help those ppl with scholarships like i could support one. I wouldnt mind especially with NFTY they will cut that work down
I run it as a business I have debt on it and in order to keep playing and developing my business kinda need to make money and work at the same time. I do love playing but i cant do it and be susstainable all the time with out the bots. I have put the money in the game im a investor in the game I have every part. So i agree low level moochers go but dont mess with high level bots who put in the money for it. I starteed grinding with nothing ppl can do it they just dont take the time. I would spend all weekend grinding to get my account where it is
It does matter lol im both a gamer and have fun but i need to make money to lol so im all for this seeparating the leeches out and letting ppl run higher level bots like mine. I consolidated to a rental account and a bot account which i also always playi n tournaments and brawls my self not using the bot. I just use archmage a for extra income.
Then the point system is borked.
If a League of Legends player with a "true" ability of Silver 1 is on Silver 1, he can play literally unlimited matches but he will stay at Silver 1, as he'll win 50% of the matches and lose 50% of the matches. Small swings obviously happens, but this hypotetical player will end up in the same place as his teoretical, true ability. That's what a MMR system is meant to do.
If in Splinterlands, bot accounts full of lvl 1 cards can just climb through the leagues by beating other bot accounts running the same bot software, something's not right. If they're at the same ability level (eg same bot software) and using the same (or really similar) cards, they should just keep wasting their time against each other, without climbing the leagues.
Back to the LoL example: if you take 1000 "true" Silver 1 players and put them against each other, after thousands of matches they'll all still be at Silver 1, as that's their correct ranking. They can't climb if they're not actually playing better.
My bot climbs to champ sometimes but i invested alot in it
llike 65K between both
The low level no investment bots should go
I disagree, I've always played games where I "fight up hill" I can put money in a game but no where near what others can. I've always made up for this with skill, learning the game and counters. I don't consider myself the best player but above average. I have a lot of max bronze cards, some max silver cards for water and 3 max silver summoners. I fight my way into gold and the frustration of playing against maxed out deck because of the last proposal which said my $1000 deck isn't good enough to earn rewards. I don't rent, overall I feel renting stagnates your account and stops growth.
So I break into gold and can beat players in gold with max out decks who aren't skilled and then get crushed by some that are skilled and some that just have max cards for gold.
I put 7 grand into this game this year after I found it in Feb but I made the decision to get set a baseline passive income so most of that went into 2 nodes. I bought 181 RW packs I'm still trying to open.
I've put money into this game but as I play I'm still contently told the skill I have isn't good enough because you haven't spent enough.
This proposal I understand what it is trying to accomplish and do, I actually somewhat support the idea before the massive shift of SPS rewards to the top end. There has to be a way for yes skilled players to earn without having to drop 5 - 10 thousand dollars ever 6 months. Most of the long term players haven't put that money in (yes there are some if not plenty who have) but overall most of them are where they are because of when they found the game.
Aggy keep saying he wants to fix spawn point in-equality but splinterlands lands keeps making it's own spawn point in-equality overall if you weren't here pre-airdrop or I'd say even alpha / beta the amount of money you have is massive more than what "top" level players have had to put in.
The tournament during splinterfest showed when a bronze player was able to compete in the tournament there is a difference between skill and having enough money to buy the cards.
Gotta have both in this model and this game you can earn in just may need to take a risk now compared to earlier when it ws cheapter. I just added 25K to my ourchases. Need to invest to or all the ppl who did would leave u with worthless cards bc if we all dump then there is no money left i deff dont want my favorite game to die plus the money time and now work im putting into my own projects for it with out are funding nothing would be made
Never said you didn't but I had a plan that keep getting nerfed from when I entered the game. When I entered SPS was over .12 so I've lost 1/2 my value there but I've manage to invest right to still be able to get 2 node. I don't have 15 - 30 grand to get a max untamed deck so I'll never be able to complete one for modern. My plan was to set up passive income and work toward CL and Rebellion when it comes out but even 181 RW packs doesn't touch what I need for silver let a lone gold and that is around $750. I have some skill in the game and still learning so I'm "okay" with the struggle fight up hill against maxed out decks in each league which they are there and most of what I fight anymore since the last proposal. While I try to build because I wasn't here in the beginning. Prior to the last proposal this one was needed now... most of the decks I fight in silver and gold are maxed for silver at least and a lot for gold.
Me to i want spt bc its bs that one org controls it.And i will soon have sure backing to be able to take it and force the vote to lower it and then change the token and distirbute to all bc they are just raking it in i have alot at one poitn and i was able to get like 50 bucks a day
mine is odd one doesnt apply to many but I was awarded 2.5 sps per common uniit so i got 25K and sold then bought from .2 on
If you held on to it price doesnt matter look at market cap
Total diff picture
Did you think about combining to one max then branching
packs are under two bucks CL prob a good buy and nodes they will be a serious good buy in my opinion only there under 2K im going to be all over those today
If you need a account to play a higher level join are organization we will be doing a live stream to open 10000 packs with other givaways to next week to show what were doing and why. Kind of explain how it will bring new players and help them grow then come out with more than they had ready to compete.
I can buy a gold deck for that cheap
THIS!
I get so tired of hearing about/reading people being told things like this.
The value of a person's collection can vary immensely. Just because someone's name isn't purple in Discord, doesn't mean they haven't invested a substantial amount of money.
People need to stop assuming that every Silver collection is worth $47 and understand that a good collection can easily be worth 5 figures $$$$$.
!BEER
My partner is on the leaderbaords renting cards she kicks ass so it its possible you just need skill and say a guild that will support some rentals
Exactly my accounts passed into 6 figures this year and its jsut bc i have the capital and love the game also want to be in on all parts like runi, td, gls, sps especially, nodes and land. There will be ways to get this stuff by winning nd grinding i did it before i put money in i started with nothing back then. My accoutn was worth 40K at the peak sold all of it then bougth back.
View or trade
BEER.Hey @cimmeron, here is a little bit of
BEERfrom @torran for you. Enjoy it!Do you want to win SOME BEER together with your friends and draw the
BEERKING.That's not true in my case. Nonetheless, what about this? Each game has a pot based on the total level of cards played. So level cards would essentially lower the pot. The winner takes the whole pot. It encourages players to level up because 1. It's easier to win with leveled up cards. 2. A player with leveled up cards will earn more over time.
This rewards good play which will make the game more fun and allows a mechanism to reward purchases.
hello sir @yabapmatt .
Can't we just remove the rewards and rating increase from, for example a gold-league battle between 1bcx vs 1bcx?
Sometimes I cannot find an appropriate level summoner to rent because there's nothing available to rent or the ones available are grossly overpriced.
So if I'm in Gold, and have to use a level 1 legendary summoner, I can still win (of course not always) but then my rewards would be significantly lower with this proposal.
I know there are many 1bcx bots in gold (I have some too), so I'm okay with losing my reward/rating if I manually win against fellow low level decks (bot or not) in Gold. But if I beat a high level (gold-capped) deck, then I feel it's unfair to get punished.
There likely will be more when nifty is integrated with many of the larger projects like mine were goign to rent a lot of cards to.
It's been a while you haven't played if you think that it's still the case.
Competition has be increasing every season for the past like 4 seasons.
I spent thousands in SPL and it takes me half the season to get out of silver sometimes.
I used to be able to get to gold with low level cards, now you have to have a maxed deck to be able to be competitive in gold because everybody is playing maxed decks.
Decks might not be maxed in silver but rewards are so low that doesn't even makes sense to punish players that don't have a great silver deck. It's a tax on a tax.
We're not even talking about rewards in bronze.
Sincerely, do be able to make that game any profitable (with still a bit of luck) is to play in diamonds at least.
Thos need to go
in a game, punish players with skill, such an idea can only come from someone who has no idea about gaming and only thinks about his money, sorry but we should not destroy the balance between game and investors even more!
No thats not true I think about both I play and I bot my accounts when i cant bc I need to fund my self and the stuff im working on and im not botting shit acccounts. I treat this like a fun thing and a business i borrrowed money to get where I am maybe if you want to get on that level you might have to take a risk. Not advice just saying you cant get anywhere that rewards you with no risk and if you couldnt take my bot kick its ass with the same cards in say a 100 battles stint you need more skill or it would make you better,
One question: Do you have contact with other people in real life?
What kind of question is that of course i do and if you look at what we are doing maybe dont judge before im sorry im able to make large investments bc i worked my dick off and am able to get lines of credit for this as well as use retirement funds like im taking real risk but the rewards will be worth it and i plan on sharing those all with my team. If we hit 1 million in profit in 12 months were all going to take 100K of that and go on vacation as a reward or pay for all the ppl to attend splitnerfest if were at 2-5 million whic his likely since we have other profit generation things in the works as well.
im just a trader and investor for my job i retired form tranditional work a few years agot young yes but i worked my ass of to do it.
i ask because your texts come across as if you are quite anti-social and have zero sense of empathy
Im just blunt i dont suger coat shit texts are completely different than in person if you met me you would think tottaly diff
okay all good 😘
I honestly dont care what ppl think they love it or hate it im going to be me.
I think ive talked in here more than anythin and visit my discord you will get a totally diff side of me
Not really anti social is it just not what you may be used to
This is business with real money on the line so no i do not suger coat it for ppl i dont care if they get offended this world is to sensitive as it is. I am trying to do whats best for my investment and the game since i do own both SPS, Cards, Splinterlands Stock and pretty much every thing i can so have a lot in here so my opinon will be made at least if ppl take it the wrong way just ask and if i fucked up ill admit it lol
Some cards are in some rulesets even worser at higher level, take the Gelatinous Cube, if you use Mimosa Nightshade or the Ruleset is "No Magic" the Gelatinous Cube level 9 is better than the level 10 version, simple because he has one livepoint more and Void is already added from the summoner or is not neccessary if no magic monster can be on the battlefield.
Then play what works better?
I think it is better if your monster has one lifepoint more without any disadvantages for this or not ?
I think the idea of this proposal is honorable, but this idea I very much dislike. It seems to me that especially gold players will be punished here, who are like the middle class of the Splinterlands ecosystem.
I OWN a lot of cards at lvl 1 that I frequently use, just because they are still good even at lvl 1. Phantom of the Abyss, Halving Alchemist, Kron the Undying, Oaken Behemoth are some examples.
These cards cost me a lot of money. Their combined worth is hundreds of dollars even right now, and I bought them at a much higher price. Kron alone was at least 300$ back then.
I feels really unfair knowing I will then be punished for paying this price and now wanting to play them like I always did.
I strongly hope this one will not pass.
Mine is 55k now lol dont kill og players shit but neeed a way to help new ppl which is what im trying to do by levelin guilds for rent or purchase with a tiny 3-4% royalty
I'm in the same boat. I've got most of the Untamed/Dice Legendaries, but only BCX 1 because they were super expensive when I got them. Some of them work well enough in higher leagues, some of them don't. It is, what it is, but if this passes, none of those cards are going to be much use to me anymore if I'm losing a percentage of my FP every time I use one.
I agree. The impact should be more substantial at the highest levels and least impactful at the lowest levels. For example give room at bronze level with a free bonus of say 20% so a player doesn't get completely hammered. Maybe a free bonus of 5% in silver, then it runs as explained in this proposal.
This proposal im good with as long as my high level bots and play is not impacted
The more I thought about it, the more cards came to my mind that were strategically of high value to purchase at a certain lvl just because they are having/getting one good ability or can act as a meatshield. I bought them all for a reason and now that reason is invalid and the decision does not make a lot of sense anymore.
Just to give you guys an idea:
most untamed/dice legendaries, all Fiends lvl 1 (meatshield), Kobold Miner lvl 3 (+1 attack), Sabre Shark lvl 2 (+1 attack), GF Chicken lvl 3 (meatshield + gf bonus), GF Ooze lvl 3 (slow + gf bonus), Medusa lvl 3 (stun), Ice Pixie lvl 1 (flying for earthquake), Coral Wraith lvl 1 (sneak and magic attack), Kelp Initiate lvl 1 (meatshield), The Kraken lvl 1 (big tank), Flesh Golem lvl 3 (self healing tank), Wood Nymph lvl 1 (front heal), Mushroom Seer lvl 1 (silence), Brownie lvl 1 (+1 speed), Mitica Headhunter lvl 1 (4 dmg, 5 speed), Divine Healer lvl 3 (from 0 to 1 magic damage), Crystal Werewolf (silence + meatshield), truthspeaker lvl 1 (protect + starter card, bought her only to not gain a minus...), Light Elemental lvl 1 (flying and solid 2 magic dmg), Undead Priest lvl 3 (from 0 to 1 magic dmg), Bone Golem lvl 1 (starter card, void and 1 speed for reversed speed), Octopider lvl 3 (demoralize), Phantom Soldier lvl 1 (flying + solid stats), Enchanted Pixie lvl 1(neutral flying for earthquake), Prismatic Energy lvl 1 (magic reflect, great with Mycelia and Obsidian), Halfing Alchemist lvl 1 (unique halving effect).
You see, these are not just one or two random cards. Especcially the wild cards are expensive and I even bought some in the alpha version to GAIN a bonus, not to lose something.
Yesterday I even managed to showcase a win with some of these cards who ALL would give a minus if the proposal passes.
I also heard that many people said we would still get more in the end if all the bots are pushed out of gold league. If that is the case, the proposal is fine on paper. It still feels very wrong to me, and as others pointed out this and other things lead to the feeling that devs dont care for the smaller guys (even though I know for sure they do!) and that humans are always collateral damage when bots are targeted. If that is done time and time again, people will feel let down.
In the end, I still love and trust the team and their game. I know everything will work out over time, but this proposal I think is not the way to do it, but of course I could be wrong and this proposal will do only good in the end.
I appreciate all of your effort and the SL team members discussing with us about this.
Finally you msut have been here a while to bc if ppl dont see it they are only here for thre money i starrted playing barely making a thing then foound out how to make money as the game changed i adapted
Since every league has it's own pool, your absolute reward shares aren't important. What is more important is the number or reward shares you earn relative to all other players in gold.
If everyone in gold feels the same as you (it's not worth it to buy more copies of those cards, then your rewards won't be affected.
The question becomes, do you have a more leveled up deck than most people in your league? If yes, then this may lower your reward shares but increase your earnings.
I like the assertiveness this formula (as an example) shows toward paying upwards to players that have more cards or more skin in the game based off their lineups at each given level. This could be something worthwhile for sure.
Staking on players will change some things
This to me just dicourages people from taking a chance at higher leagues. It's incredibly expensive to bring all your cards up to the next level. I had almost all my cards at silver level recently and diecided to try my hand at gold. Since I've been there I've probably spent $1500 bring a few cards up to gold. But for what if now I'm going to make silver level rewards if I don't spend another $50k to get them all there immediately.
This constant moving of the goal posts makes me want to go back to just renting out my cards instead of playing.
Im at 35K lol
so there must be a copermise bc ppl that spent 60 K on a account like me will not be happy to be cut out of a reward thing. Im all for adding more fairness where the team decies to but cut the legs off early players who hold alot what if ppl dump and basically crush the market. I dont think it will happen i mean im not parting with mine but it needs to be a medioum
I don't think anybody is trying to cut you out. We just don't believe it's right for you to get richer through taxing us smaller accounts more. You have already made yourself a profitable business with your investment. I'm happy for you. I really am. I just don't think it's right to employ market manipulation to further inflate your earnings. You're doing well enough. No need to fleece new players.
how am i fleecing ppl im creating 50 guilds to onboard new player help them get inl Cut my legs out thos wont exist
and i dump my cards to just hold sps
There needs to be a higher incentive at higher levels period otherwise why level ill make 50 low level bots
Dangle the carrot, wiggle the stick..
Agreed.. I started the game last summer so I got here just in time to buy a bunch of expensive cards before prices tanked and also catch all the reward nerfs.
With every nerf, I'd have to spend more to keep earning. Now I'm at a point where it's like $1-2k for the next league and for what? The same thing to happen again in a season or two? I'm not supporting them enough through the market, Dice, CL, TD, Runi, and RW that I have to either keep spending magnitudes more or else give up more and more rewards too?
Yep.
Im all for this if it incentivizes card ownership. I personally would like reward shares cut in half for rented cards, the bot armies that only rent cards would be most effected and it would lower the amount of value they are able to extract. People that rent a few cards to fill out their decks will still do so because what would they be without their crutches, jk jk DR Blight renters :)
Fine with me i bot but my bots are funded alot
we dont want to kill rentls we all make a lot on them
if thats a serios thing i have to dump all my cards lol and buy sps to wait that out
That will cut of a huge plater base
so blight rents good lol maybe ill have to rent it out
Going to be selling everything if this one passes. What a horrible proposal. Literally no upside at all, just potential downside for players. Get your head straight SPL
If you do what do you have and to avoidf the selling mainia if it happens id offer higher than market half way and you meet in the middle to and i may buy all of your assets if they are goood at a fair pricce less the 5% charge. Or if you need out right away ill habve to fire sale it. but I would loveto pick though if you decide to quit
Ill buy nodes and land if you do
So move away from any skill needed?
Make the game more complex and it will find a balance.
IM giong to be playing one acount but my bots are funded and i need cash flow 24/7 to run my project in the early stages which if complett will benefit eveyone here. So i think the small bots i run at 500K to a million cp arent necessarily bad as im doing it for new players and profit
I think level 1 cards always need value and need to be playable.
To be honest, a diamond or gold deck sells super bad.
The highest accessibility to new players is level 1 cards. I dont think many new player say "let's spend 300k on that game".
A test league with skill only and all cards have same stats from level 1 to max and only rewards change could be a thing.
If it sucks, remove it.
If its cool, why not?
I mean at this point rewards are fixed + everyone could be champion, only the rewards are different. I mean that would be a real play to earn or not?
And maybe remove ghost cards to a minimum possible.
Ijust think old players should not be punished my self and many others have been playing this game for 5 years or more and maybe time should weight into the vote to. Bc we have in most cases invested alot more. Im all about helping ppl get up there and earn but not at cost to my unless i decide to give it which i do alot. But no rule lowering my Ernings or other large investors but have maybe a card wining prize with less money so the deck can advnace. I grinded up in alpha beta i did good took a year or two but that can be devalued totally bc weve been playing a long long time. Need a way to make ppl happy and not lower are rewards if you are considerd a whale bc if the whales go dump everything what will you play - not like i want tht it would be the worst for me i have a bit of it all here lol
If the rental market works " perfect". That would mean easy to use for new people.
Then the changes could make a lot of sense.
Like "top 20" decks for rent or something like that.
If rental market should drop massive, card prices will drop massive short after it, means yields will drop after it too.
I dont want my 100-500% cards to go
I love my rental account too.
But if the yield is "-card value" because of less new players, I'm in favor of a more sustainable model :D
If panic should hit in and we end up in PVP market, it will become dirty.
That's why more players and more hands are better in a more accessible game.
I have no problem holding in a "bera market",but the game needs in the meanwhile the ability to grow in users IMO.
Im making one but with a new approch that doesnt involv paying but staking x hive or spt based on the cards you want and its a lease signed for a month so no one can break it with out penaltis
IDK :)
Im in favour of everything that works with one click " rent for cash". No research needed, Player see the price for timeframe x and can purchase or not for different levels for example.
Works best in e-commerce, so why not here :D
Ehhh i dunno i think this would really make me money so I dont know if im against it lol
I love a working rental market too :)
What about a month guaranteed rent with x delegation of a token that votes so i can get my money from voting it
Could work
I may sell off alot and wait stock up on sps to get drop and node drop
Then im guaranteed a nice eoy bonus with drops and runi as well as all the staking and lp rewards
Cant let it drop then keep it fair but also we dont want to centralize it and ruin shit for other players who have hundreeds of thousands in this.
sure it needs a free market balance.
Another idea would be to let the proposal work and add for a "skill variant" a change of season rewards in the league for top players.
So skill really matter, and even a player with lower $ invested could have a "top player experience".
I maybe look at things a bit differently, because I played a lot of competitive games like starcraft.
It doesnt really now my bot i leave it for 5 days im in diamond 1 with both. They are stacked bots 20-30K each lol
I look at it from both im not having my legs cut out on a large investment but am using that to help the community and earn so if i get my earnings cut out ill have scrap a project im really passionate about and think will help maybe look at it. I mean not all ingestors are bad but if we put 100 k in we need a return as well i could make a lot more if i was trying to screw everyone
Sure,
That's the balance needed to find. But IMO the game is different to a 2k investment 10k investment and more.
Sure nobody needs to have all cards or something like that. Rentals are also cool.
But I think the game sucks for new users.
Another cool thing that could be fun for new users are "shared cards". like someone in a guild allows all members to use the cards and earn 70% of the earned rewards.
For players is "no investment" needed and the most skilled can earn the most.
Something like that would be cool IMO. Simple and easy.
I nkow it is ivre played it at all levels from 100 to 100K investment
You want to play at higher levels and have access to quite a bit of cards. We will be having NFTY making are decks im opening a early 2000 packs to get some decks goign had to push back the stream so want to start making money first lol. You can also play a entire guild your self thoguh NIFTY and just play every account and fray
Grow that guild we will prob bot it while you are not playing. Add your personal account to it and then the rest are guild accounts owned by us and we take a 50% split plus gladious cards in the accounts that are not your account so you keep your galdious cards for that one but still split the rewards for the Managing parntners and Senior Partners. You will also be able to lease the guild if you want to take it and use it and we just charge a 15% royalty on cash flow and 15% of any capital gain with the royalty going to 5% after 5 years. terms may change not final yet. Also cna buy or lease specific accounts from the guild which will be priced according to the gladous cards in them. We will also have a purchase option at after 3-5 years for a predetermined price and premium up front for the option. But right now you can grow a entie guild a few accounts and yours etc. But will register through NFTy in are discord they willl get everyone set up. Are DAO is set up as a main DAO for Managing Partners that gets a cut of all the guild profits via the conracts through NFTY. Later on we can see if they can manager guild rentals and leases as well as purchases. We are also open to any interesting project that will make money lol. We are pretty chill and dont wnat any ass holes or crazy ppl lol who are like going to flip out ill just kick them and already confirmd that with my parnters and one of them is in charge of that but it takes a lot to bug us and get kicked only did it to one person at the begingng. complete dick. lol. DM if you want to come in the discord and check out what were dong still just setting it up and you will be starting with us pretty much. Also can play WOO, GLG, TD as we have packs for that to. Also many non gmaing projects like curation with HIVE, STEEM, PulishOx, other sites googled it once there was like 20. lol. But first thing is the guild and rentals for all cards then curation and reinvestment of half of partners earnings into the guilds capital accounts for each of them and half goes to paying back the loans of assets from me, Shiro, JOSIB the and after that then that goes away after all the cash is returned to us since we fronted it for now. But shold be a quick payback i hope.
I agree on skill totally
NFty will be doing this for my cards when i open my 10000 packs i bought and managing my whole guilds for them.
You may need to get capital or borrow it liek a business. I have debt on my splinterlands business. Nothing is free I took a huge risk and it paid off. Gotta be willing to grind and plow though. if you have a grand or two you can get a gret deck
If you are in the us I do havre a way u can its imposible to fail at making 2-5K
Or give everyone the ability to use them either way. Rentals also i want to do a cheaper service with spt but no interest yet for some reason.
They would be fixed for a month
I get votes to use in return
Dont plan on selling them
ppl have skill i jsut cant play 24/7 and want to earn 24/7. I have al ot in my accounts so i think its fair i can use the 75K total invested to battle while im working on other stuff.
Congratulations @sps.dao! You have completed the following achievement on the Hive blockchain and have been rewarded with new badge(s):
Your next target is to reach 20 posts.
Your next target is to reach 800 upvotes.
You can view your badges on your board and compare yourself to others in the Ranking
If you no longer want to receive notifications, reply to this comment with the word
STOPTo support your work, I also upvoted your post!
Support the HiveBuzz project. Vote for our proposal!
Now is the time to get the SPS think about the GLX drop and GLX nodes another year with a lot more SPS most ppl have now to get the GLX 20% reserved for us. IM getting to 2-3 million this year to suck in that.
I tapped my solo 401K to use in this to so i can get the necessary power and infuence in the game to support me and my projects only at 500K now but will be buying alot more soon.
That gives you 27% on 3 million or almost 600K worth plus vouchers will be a swing in the rates when they blow up and down with cycles lke i want to be producing them at a massive rate to be able to buy what i need to build and now i thik its the time to get the investment if you want it to get full GLX benefits
None of my comments are advice at all its my personal decisions and beleif that this game as a whole with the other games i also get a stake in due to the ingvestments I have in the company and the daos. Its a risk but if you are confident about the game like i am im good with the fluctuatons just like the stock market shit goes up and down mine all end up evening out or going up.
Im just a guy who has played this game a long time and love games likke it also im working on my project which will help in guilds wiht new players.
If your goal is to shrink your player base by spitting on anyone who isn't in a position to afford max levels for a league; then this is a very good way to go about it!
There are ppl who are setting up things like i am to help new players
hmm, i dont think the max level playable in a given league should be the requirement to earn max rewards. maybe 1 level below or something. not really fair to limit diamond earnings if playing with lvl 9 commons, lvl 7 rares, and lvl 5 epics since those last levels cost almost the same as all the levels leading up to it. I like the general idea though, just maybe tweak the details a bit like I suggested (or some other tweak).
Agree with that no level should be prohbited if the person can make it there on it
Its not my partner kicks ass with not all maxed cards she rents and is in champion.
agree with that point bc you can have actual skill maybe lower that a bit
Boooo! This is another push to give yet more rewards to those with the most money. Higher level cards already get extra rewards just from the fact that it's easier to win when your cards are maxed out. You're penalizing players who can't afford to max out their decks, and also penalizing those who are able to rise up the ranks despite not having a maxed out deck.
We need a compermise bc ppl who have invested for 5 years like me do not want to see there shit killled and te hours playing you just need to put in your time to or figure out what the guy did to get high up with a low level deck. I can delegate cards strong maxed ones mostly but will cost not dec a stake that will provide a vote that is significant for me to use while u rent it.
Can you borrow money ? bc i did to do what im doing? Dont assume its all ppl with massive amounts of money but I do have a good amount but look at what im doing with it here like come on cut that out my project ill need t ocut any losses and stop re evlauate go ont o finding the mostp profitabl thing to do. If anything why are we not talking about the monoppoly on curation?
U should get the rewarded to
I think it's crap. For example, I use extra sandworm level 1 with slug rule. I think tactical finesse and skill should not be punished. if i am so good that i beat diamond players with my silver deck, i should be rewarded if anything and not punished! let people live the freedom and skill as they want!
i personally won't have any disadvantage from this change. but as a passionate gamer, i don't like the idea of penalizing skills just because you don't want to ban bots. somewhere it's an incentive to climb up despite worse cards and defeat people with better decks
it's hard enough for play to earn games to keep the balance between fair play and pay to win. to destroy it so wantonly is really grandiose!
just ban bots, that would save us a lot!
Agreed.. If I can beat your higher level deck with my lower level deck, why am I being penalized for playing better?
Also funny how they don't want us to play up a league without being penalized but yet it's still ok for Diamond/Champ players to come down and crush Bronze/Silver tournaments on the regular.
Agree with you bro, if they remove bots, lots of problem will be solve.
Not all bots just the low level no investment ones
That wont happen because they top 1% own 90% of the bots...
yes unfortunately I know that too :(
We all know yes is going to win, whales with maxed cards are those with more sps staked to direct the vote, they of course will vote yes to earn the max and reduce others earnings...just release that change and don't waste time with the vote, again punish little players to punish bots
Not always the case I have alarge account or a few i bot but with out that how could i create my project geared at helping new players and I do deserve a paycheck form it so why not in stead of bitching figure out a way to do it . I could tell you a million ways to literally get a 100K account if you in the uu jsut most i have found cant wrap thereheat ourj it adn dississs things they dont know so fast.
I don't really understand why all the rules ends up reducing the rewards of skillful players that, through good usage of strategy, can achieve high rankings, while increasing the rewards of players that just bash through everything with ultra-expensive, high-leveled cards.
It's a game, after all: bad players should receive less rewards than good players. This rule will just increase the rewards of bad players that just bulldozer their way through the rankings with old, high-leveled expensive cards; and punish good players that can outsmart the opponents.
Well said, I feel the same way. Accounts shouldn't be punished for having more skill than another.
There is a investment aspect as well how can ppl play 24/7 they cant so you play turn your bot on and play when you can use the money you eanred to do something with like im using it to build a business here to help with somet hings that will go up in smoke if i cant bot my high level accounts to add additional funding and if you dont want them at high levels many match prob wil take a while to find and you maek less to. Why not just put one on yourself when your not playing get the same type of advantage and my bot loses half the time it just ends up making me money over night that I can use to fund my project here
I'm sure new players would be happy to spend even more to upgrade their cards rather than use brains and strategy!
If there is a bug in game mechanics then fix that!
Spellbook, land, node license and now more cards to earn a token which is locked away for 4 weeks and can only be claimed if you earned enough, on top of just trying to keep up with releases
Its tottally differnt strategies in high levels
I totally read this wrong, the level limits are lower for rewards than they are for lvl requirements per league. I LOVE THIS!
Not in champion league. I do own many cards at level 7 rare and upgrading them to max doesn't change anything good. Cost to upgrade those level 7 to 8 is almost the same to buy that level 7. This means for all those cards I need to spend two times my whole splinterlands journey which don't even bring any good to the stats. Especially those old cards needs huge money to max them.
It is usually cheaper to just buy a maxed card
Yes but this wasn't the case when the set was released. I had to accumulate bcx and then upgraded. Now why I'll buy a max card if I only need half bcx?
I have them to been around a while to
You are lucky to enter splinterlands in this time. Only players who entered splinterlands during peak just before the pre sale of chaos legion are badly hurt and in big down in value. Rest all players are either early adopters and gained alot or entered late enough when prices were minimum.
im a early investor in the common stock seed round i was here real early
Timing has a very large difference in earnings. You are lucky to get in so early
yes i was i bumped into it on the internet and got the chance to iunvest in it very lucky
I wasn't that much active those days, so had no information.
To earn max i think it hsould be a investment but maybe lower than a max deck
Yes, requirements should be slightly lower than max
me to i just changed my vote
This is the worst proposal that I've seen so far.
SPL teams keeps "acknowledging" that they need to focus on attracting new players and keep them but all the decisions that are being made are going towards the opposite.
Keep them coming that way and this game will be dead even before the next expansion.
Most of rewards are already going to old players and every update keeps amplifying that.
Can't believe that this option is even considered.
That's the problem with DAO's, Proposals are made by Mav's to benefit themselves. Then other's at the same level with high voting power agree as it benefits them also, and if you don't have the other 80%+ of the community voting against it, then you have no chance.
Flawed design in my opinion, because if you give everyone with staked sps the same voting power, then you will have the 10k bot accounts swaying the votes instead. I see the need for decentralization in crypto to get around government regulations (especially for US companies) but there needs to be a better way to make/vote on proposals to get a better idea of what the 'COMMUNITY' wants.
Decentralized governance is such a joke! Especially when they keep shifting all of the rewards up to the top 0.01% of players.
Good luck getting your vote to count earning .83 SPS/day while the top is earning and compounding exponentially.
!BEER
Yes it's a good one. In my opinion everyone's voting power should should be in a certain range. Like for example, it'll start with 1 and end at 10. It'll still depend on staked sps but for a certain amount of sps staked, it'll be capped. One can make it like 2000-3000 sps staked will give 1 voting power and even if anyone staking 1m sps, they are still at 10 voting power only. This will make the average individual players vote more valuable. Making it negligible for bots to make an impact on voting and on opposite end, suppressing the voting with huge amount of sps staked by biggies
Does the community want a large organization that is helping get new players into guilds and earn then letting the players that stay take tehe guild acount they played ofr two years or what ever . Also I mak surewe have what we neeed .
I understand how this could be thought as an improvement, I would probably get a lot more share rewards but I think this will completely demotivate new players.
The rich get richer and the poor get poorer, do we not want new players coming in?
Just ban bots already or implement new player rewards instead of just pushing these kind of changes that might just hurt more in the long term.
We need ppl to start projects like the one imi doing to rent upgraded guilds or sell the mto new players so they dont need to spend years we are doing 50 gulds at once
Only rent will be a 10% cf share
Would you mind sharing your project?
Really good proposal, when I played for a moment in silver or gold league there was a plenty of accounts using only 1 lvl cards and that drains pool, so people complain about low sps rewards, this new formula looks really cool, anyway in champ or even in diamond I will see no difference, cuz there so much competition, but for players in lower leagues, which are not bots and playing around rental market well - that change gonna be huge!
really how did they get there lol
I play a deck with all level 1 cards I get to gold 2 and stay competitive. It's not my fault some of these rich bots are poor players. A decent player with a maxed out deck has a huge advantage over me. If they want to put their accounts on a bot, that's on them. Splinterlands shouldn't be trying to facilitate that IMO.
My bot shreds it and then i play the league i like skipping the boring ones
This sounds like a proposal written by a Mav that's tired of losing to lower level collections that are not fully maxed or are playing above their league.
My biggest problem with this is I have a LOT of Untamed cards that are only max Bronze league and too expensive to level any higher. Some of those cards still work well in Silver and Gold.
Also, some cards are better in certain rulesets as a lower level card and some cards might have stats at the next level you don't really care for.
I find it crazy that I could be penalized for playing in Gold with my mostly max Silver collection. The fact that this proposal is being announced and nothing has been done about Diamond and Champion players smurfing Bronze/Silver tournaments shows where the team's mindset really is. Didn't we just increase their reward pool by a ton?
Maybe if we stopped stripping the rewards from the lower leagues, people wouldn't be clamoring into higher leagues with half-assed decks just so they can have another shot at earning $0.02.
Leveling my Untamed cards would cost thousands of dollars and renting all of those cards is a poor financial decision. Leveling everything else is still $1-2k additional investment.
To be honest... Maybe I should've skipped Tower Defense and GLS and Runi and Riftwatchers and everything else I keep buying into to support you and focused solely on Chaos Legion. I mean.. I can't wait for my Dr. Blight promo card to penalize me for playing it.
Are yo pretty good? I have the cards mostly maxed alpha some beta saom pretty much all additions some. And other things. I need to get cash flow to buy land and we need guild 2-5 managed and created. Right now we would populate the guild you would play all frays in this gase
That's probably debatable but I do ok lol
!BEER
not on this account on my other lol this one is my rental account
Runi will be a chance im willing to gamble on could be huge
They wre cheap for a bit i built a nice three decks for 40K AND I WENT overboard
Now im at 100K and think its great lol
Yes exactly.
If you use a high level deck but get beaten by a low level or 1 BCX deck, then the the winner should actually be rewarded more instead of getting deductions for using low level deck.
Or maybe the loser would forfeit a random high level card from his deck and transfer it to the winner, because the loser is just wasting the high level card if he still loses to low level.
No way
Card transfering should be a thing that is optional bet kind of thing no wat shoudl it be forced
This comment! I couldn't put it better myself.
We are rewarding big investors in the game, but we should also reward skillful players. This is a game to begin with -- gameplay, competitiveness, and most of all enjoyment should be the utmost priorities if we want this game to grow much bigger and to increase userbase.
Rewarding skilled players sounds much better and more attractive than penalizing them.
We need a middle ground bc if it goes the way of screwing ppl like me who do bot large accounts only a few to fund developement and pay for things all your accounts will prob die to bc anyone doing the same thing will dump and I dont want to do that i love the posssiblities that you can be a investor player and developer and owner. Im not sure where your from etc but my partners are from the philipines they make bank renting and are skilled players compete fine with bots. My best playrer could kick my bots ass so maybe som of the skilled playrers are not as skilled as they think
Well said. But can we be surprised that once again new changes and reward proposals will punish the very people this game needs to nurture...
My bot kicks ass so im in diamond when i get to play in the season if you are a MAV you have invested a lot in the game and intend on sticking aournd usualy and getting rewarded for doing so
I'm not a mav but I've likely invested more than some of them. That still doesn't mean I intend on sticking around though. Maybe I will, maybe I won't. I'm not very happy with a lot of the changes over the past few months and also the lack of Quality of Life fixes that people have been asking for over the past year.
Seems like more and more proposals are with the intention of securing the games for the truly rich and less for newer players.
Get rich i started here with 10 bucks and spent a grand total before now
Exactly
With out the investors there are no scholorships and yes some are not good deals but check out my organiziatoin we are getting off the ground with NFTY and managing up to 1500 players and all you need to do is ask for whatyou need
If a player with all lvl 1 cards has the skill to defeat a player with max lvl cards I think they should get more rewards not less.
Did not like what i see. I recommend more thought before doing anything. Good Night! 👋
Ok, ok, ok. I'm sorry. I'll stop talking shit every time I beat a max level team with an all level 1 deck. I'm sorry, boss. You're the best. I was just lucky. Please don't take away rewards from me.
You havre skill then and should not be punished
This does punish the skilled player specifically.
If there that skilled shouldnt they earn alot of sps which can be used to stake build up dialy income to buy cards
There needs to be a incentive to own assets to as well as some will still rent but if people own assets probably half the players would beenfit
What is the percentage of accounts in silver or gold that are playing with level 1 cards? How many extra SPS are rewarded for level 1 cards, comparing with and without this change? Splinterlands should reveal the data like this if they want to get more support from the community.
I think there should be a video for a proposal like this explaining the change. I'm sure some people don't realize that "you can play with no penalty in gold with a max silver deck. you can play with no penalty in silver with a max bronze deck. You start to get penalized when you play in gold with max bronze deck."
I heard that there's going to be a change where you can pick the level of cards you can use. If that is announced, that changes things as well.
I see a lack of information and communication here.
This proposal is a direct attack on newer players and those that don't have a lot of money to spend on the game. Right now, as one of those players, I can use skill with my lower level cards to beat higher level players/cards and people botting with higher level cards. That is the one single advantage I have (my intelligence and skill). The advantage people with money and early adopters have is that they have higher level cards. By increasing that advantage (giving them more rewards for using those cards), it absolutely decreases my ability to compete. I hope it is perfectly clear to everyone that this proposal is very much anti-new players and anti-krill (to borrow a term from Luke). Anyone who hopes to grow the player base by incentivizing new players to join should vote no for this. I sincerely believe that it will not encourage players to level up their cards. It will incentivize them to leave the game.
Do you want to use your skill in a guild that will help you join mine were doing many guilds to build them up and we will provide cards to good players if they can get to champ they will be delegated a champ deck
Guess im maxing the remaining ones lucky not many
Congratulations @sps.dao! Your post has been a top performer on the Hive blockchain and you have been rewarded with the following badge:
You can view your badges on your board and compare yourself to others in the Ranking
If you no longer want to receive notifications, reply to this comment with the word
STOPSupport the HiveBuzz project. Vote for our proposal!
The way I see it when land gets here the bots are not going to be able to keep up anyway. Really hate seeing my chicken nerfed though. Wen land :)
So basically the card levels needed for full rewards is the max level of the league before that.
A maxed out silver deck earns full rewards in gold.
Gives you the chance to sneak a peak of what's coming, climb up there once you mastered silver, still earn full rewards in gold while then building up your deck again to the next level.
Yet, no more renting of cheap cards to get to diamond/champion based on CP alone.
That is a good thing.
But: There are certain cards that make no sense to level them further, in fact you do not want to.
Maybe my strategy needs the creeping ooze to stay low level so it is a sniper target which would be lost if it gets melee. And there are other cards out there, where the last levels increase simply one health or armor without any new abilities.
So from a strategic and efficiency point of view it is not so good.
I like the fact, that the issue is addressed and a solution is proposed. Maybe it needs some more tweaking around?
cool!👍
Against this proposal, it limits to many cards that would not be used often but are used as clutch monsters in certain situations such as exploding dwarf and exploding rat.
For some, it may not be worth the level-up of an exploding rat or dwarf for the extra abilities if they only use it in an opportunity+ equalizer game
That said having a level one sitting around for those particular rulesets would be handy and shouldn't be penalized as part of regular gameplay.
It may also cause card concentration as new cards would need to be maxed to a certain point to earn rewards and disincentize rentals.
For Example, A GF Legendary Alpha under this proposal would be penalized unless you merged it with another card. Such as a GF Gold Dragon with a second GF Dragon.
I would not support penalizing Alpha Pack Holders of rare cards to upgrade those units.
So based on what's being said in the Mav chat, I get the feeling that they consider me an "exploit" because I'm able to advance beyond what they think my cards should allow me to. I don't consider that an exploit. I consider it an incentive to play. If you consider players being good enough to be competitive beyond their decks, just gate keep the league. Don't let us play there.
I'm not exploiting anything. I'm just competing. I thought that is what this is all about. It's not my fault that your bots are too stupid to beat me more often then they already do.
its not if your not the level 1 botter you could prob kick my maxed bot accounts ass thats my point to dont punish large investors botting and working on things that they need that money for and for ppl sayying im making enough no im not. To make enough this is what I do now so enough is just a matter of scale now and i shoudl be able to scale as much as i can. I take on debt just like a business does and im not jsut sucking rewward out most go right back into my project right now. If no one wants me to try to build up guilds to help new players out thats fine ill take my 100K and exit put it to work in a passive investment and live just fine I enjoy playing but I also need to make money with my investments of that size. There is no way fleecing players by building things that help is a thing which wasnt you comenment . Your right my bots should not be able to beat ppl with real skill and they dont they lose but I sitll win to and it funds my development and life. I can easily take my money just invest it in a a bunch of defi protocals and do fine but I like this game and have been all into it for a long time. You cant chop off legs of ppl that have but a lot of work bc you just came in yes the low level bots need to go I agree.
Dude I don't know what the hell you're talking about. Nobody ever said anything about punishing you. In fact, these MFers are basically trying to suck you off while punishing me for what you do. When it comes to folks extracting value from the system, it's you, not me.
But I'm not mad at you. Hell that's the way they designed the game. You pay, you win. And that's fine. I don't care about that at all. I also don't care that you and players like you extract the vast majority of the value from the game as was proven by analyzing the data. That's the way the game is made. I just don't want to be blamed for doing it, especially when I pay into the system. Splinterlands isn't a money making venture to me. I lose money playing this game which means I actually add value into the economy! These motherfuckers don't understand that so they want to try to squeeze me more. That's what I'm arguing against.
If you can do it ther should be no limit on skill
TLDR: What is the Silver estimated annual ROI?
TLDR: What prevents Bots from buying the max tier cards and rinsing and repeating while new players start with level 1 cards and fight max bots
TLDR: How will this impact new player gameplay in the long run?
For a 600-dollar deck a silver chest averages 5.8 cents based on splex rates under reward pools
These per Battle SPS payouts are calculated with 100% ecr,no bonuses (Gold Foil, A/B, Guild etc) and no penalties (Starter Cards).
0.016 SPS at Silver II Wild
0.072 SPS at Silver II Modern
Assumption 1 Season is 200 battles
You win 100 with 2 seasons a month
200 Won Battles at Silver Level monthly
Receive 50 Silver chests a season so 100 Silver a month
Average 4 Silver Chests a day for this calc ignore the bronze drop for 1 year
In one year you would receive
1200 Silver Season Chests * 0.058 Cents = 30.624 USD
Wild 2400 Battles * 0.016 SPS = 38.4 SPS * SPS price of 0.065 = 2.496 USD
Modern 2400 Battles * 0.072 SPS = 172.8 SPS * SPS Price of 0.065 = 33.12 USD
SPS is currently worth 0.065 Cents
4 daily Silvers * 365 = 1460 * 0.058 Cents = 84.68 USD
So in one year, a Wild player would make from Season Chests and Battles
33.12 USD playing Wild
41.856 USD playing Modern
84.68 USD for Daily Chests
117.18 for Wild
126.536 for Modern
So the proposal is asking to reduce a 20% annual return to 14-16%
Would not say its worth it for an active user to buy a 600 dollar deck at present, will it prevent bots from just buying the max and having a lot of new players fighting max silver bots I would say no.
RC can't go below 50 so it limits the use already
If I run a bot having it at 50 and autoplay when ECR charges even limiting cards would just make it so that bots only play a fixed set of bought cards buy them once and repeat the loop.
Newbies and real players would have level 1's bots would have their maxes so it's a terrible outcome.
im getting more than that with my maxed mostly deck and play brawls tournaments in person and let bot rip when i cant to get extra cash flow per hour
Anyone who started playing this game after Untamed was sold out, like i did, please vote this down.
This means if you cannot afford to level up your 1 bcx Untamed cards you will be forced to sell them to the whales.
I plan to remove my meager holdings from all LPs convert to SPS and probably sell some 1 bcx Untamed cards just to stake and vote against this well meaning but misguided proposal. This will still not be alot. Please join that is the beauty of a DAO.
e.g. I literally just bought 2 1 bcx Untamed cards for 5 bucks a pop in order to "move up to diamond even tho my deck is barely gold worthy. If this passes i have to go back to bronze or just sell some of my best cards which would mean going to at least silver.
Am i missing something? Feels like the Lords are Disarming the peasants no?
This proposal makes cards more demanding, but removes one important strategy.
Using low-level cards is kind of strategy to win. Low-level cards are stronger in some different rule-sets, especially Reverse Speed.
Sometimes we also want to see the underdog's win and their proper reward.
How about removing 50% (or proper percent) of Liquidity Pool DEC rewards and giving them to Splinterlands Cards holders?
Splinterlands used to give SPS to card holders for a year.
Currently, selling cards and putting coins into LPs is much more profitable than playing with their own cards.
Players who own their cards should be rewarded but not much, so they have to play for more profit.
Winning Ranked battles with their own cards should be rewarded more than just putting coins into Liquidity Pools.
Because SPS is fixed and planned to be rewarded, DEC rewards to card holders can be a good solution.
This makes players to have more cards and doesn't destroy low-level cards' potential power.
love the rewards for all card holders that would be great but still doesnt help low level players much bc I am in the top area and id get the most bnefit
I no longer vote in proposals, as it has become completely pointless. This is just a means for people to think they have a voice. YOU HAVE NO VOICE MR KRILL, NO VOICE. I am from a developing country and you constantly make decisions that hamper my growth in the game. Seems like SPL is following the Axie route on exploiting people from developing countries, to do the grinding while the true earnings stay with those who have.
I expect my rant to be dismissed like so many other Krill comments. I love the game but my trust in the team is broken. I really believed in Spawn Point Economy, but this is just capitalism, nothing new. Exploit the poor & middle class & make the rich richer, all the while saying "We create equal opportunity"
This isn't capitalism, it's textbook market manipulation.
Wht not clim us grind then get your account to a leve u want. I had to do it ? Now that I have a large account I should be punishdd? Ant for making a project that will help new players alot wouldnt that be a good thing to have which is not possible with no earnings 24/7. Its not black and white
My three equal partners in my guild are from developing countries and that has no bearing on there pay they will get what i do
Im not sure this really solve the problem of bots in bronze and silver sucking out all the rewards for those tiers. Its hard enough for lower league non bot players to rent older cards to rank up (llama, kron, mylor, abyss) and earn back renting cost from the rewards at that tier. And now we're punishing Silver-Gold players too who rents 1 bcx "great cards" that makes them competitive at that tier. Second, this still does not change the fact that 55% of the rewards goes to Diamond and Champion tier players which is about 1-3% of actual non-bot players. Im not saying they dont deserve to get that much, but this only buffs up their rewards as they're the ones who have MAX LEVELED decks and the only ones not affected by this change which in turn actually benefits them. How? Gold players (majority of the crowd) dont necessarily have max level everything hence they get less SPS rewards and drains the pool much slower. Which means the max level deck players gets more sustained HIGH rewards all through out the season.
Why not doing it the right way, by making the Rshare follow the exact league minimum power, Silver 3, Silver 2, Silver 1 shouldn't be all the same, And include Summoners too, that's the way the game should be played, Bots spamming matches with 1Bcx cards need to up their game or stop
From what I can tell, my rewards will increase after this change. But it looks like it's just another way of preventing game exploitation while hurting those with smaller wallets. Just another proposal to keep the whales happy in the bear market while screwing the little guy.😞
I grinded from nothing to a whale you have to put effort and time it took me a year.
Respect. I've actually done a complete 360 on my opinion after discussing this with community members on discord and looking at the numbers they provided. This won't hurt the REAL little guy.
Why cant the little guy get alittle bigger doesnt take much maybe a few grand to get a decent deck
Not the case my partner rents each season and could kick my 100K bots ass. Without say a projected like mine that helps onboard and get new platers what whe need to win in my guild i odont know how othes are run but my team is taken care of.
I have to add that there are some cards that are better at level 1 than at max level in certain situations (or at a lower level). How many people have upgraded their fiends, for example? Not saying maxed-out fiends cannot be powerful - just how often a maxed-out fiend is used in-game currently. Level 1 fiends are used so often. Same for the Furious Chicken. How many own/use it at max level?
While I understand why the proposal was made, and generally I like it because I'm one of the players who use upgraded cards (many maxed out), there are situations where the gameplay logic favors non-upgraded cards.
Therefore, this proposal may need some revising for the final form, I believe.
I echo the above, as soon as I read this, I kept thinking '0 man fiend. 1 mana fillers'. They're tactical cards and used as shields, and dumb to upgrade. This proposal has its flaws.
Yep I would not want to play a lv 5 Furious Chicken in Champion vs a Level 6 and get a penalty
Same stats same abilities just one would be penalized the other would not due to it being level 6 lol.
Yes agree even though i was dumb upgraded my chicken lol
I fail to see how this benefits lower level players or makes the game attractive to new players in any way, shape, or form.
even though the change would probably have an advantage for me reward-wise. i don't like the basic idea, limiting skill/freedom is a nogo for a game in my opinion. maybe i'm looking at it wrong. but i think the game is more successful when it's primarily a game and you can earn from it. but i have the feeling that the priority changes and it becomes primarily an investment where you can play a bit on the side. i don't believe this is a success model to follow!
I agree limiting skill shouldnt be a goal or needs to be remedied bc thats not fair
100% against this. Absolutely not necessary and bad for the game. Punishing skilled players for winning with weaker cards is not the way to do it.
The ghost card punishment is already doing what this does but much better.
On top of that, some cards are better at a lower level, on certain rule sets, especially reverse speed. I only have a level 1 Sand Worm and I get to use it in Gold when it's reverse speed.
Will absolutely be voting against this one. If someone can win with lower level cards than they deserve to win. Those that cant should get better cards. Its as simple as that.
In my own opinion it will lessen new players to come in and some old players would quit as they need to spend much more money just to earn few rewards(depends on the league).
I may lower my card stake if prices are good and flip it to sps to get GLX and nodes air drops that seems to be a much better strategy right now then rebuy with all the extra income and open the 10K packs coming in
This is actually a better proposal than I expected when others have discussed it. It still allows for movement in the leagues without being penalised.
While it's not directly related to this proposal, after reading through the comments I'd like to bring up the fact that there is still something feeling broken with how changes have been progressing in that I'm seeing more and more people who can afford it putting their accounts on bots instead of playing them any more, because they are no longer enjoying the game play as much, but still want to be earning from their investment. Granted, the reason that gameplay is not so much fun any more is because we're now facing fully levelled rental decks loaded with epics and legendaries match after match, which is kind of what you were wanting to encourage, but when I speak to these players they aren't enjoying the game play either, they are just desperate to try and make a return any way they can and this is the only way they can. Many are in third/second world countries where they need it as an income, so they have also lost the enjoyment of it and it's become just a way to earn a living.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that it's a fine balance between making sure that the system isn't being milked while also not pushing more people towards the very activities which cause them to milk in the first place. The bot activity is increasing because the human brain will struggle to compete with the kind of decks people are renting. Ultimately, if the enjoyment of the game is lost then the game itself will be lost.
I have fun i just dont want to play lower levels so i bot until diamond 1 then i play so i dont waste my time palying lower leaguse when my bot ust rips though. Plus I dont have 24/7 everyone should get a bot bc why would yuo not you max ur rewwards that way. I love the game but i bot my strong decks bc its basically a gift horse to diamond and champion while i sleep then i paly the fun ones.
Here you are confirming that the lower leagues aren't much fun to play in and I hear you. I like some of the abilities that come with gold level cards and it's disappointing not being able to use them when I'm sent back to silver. Not everyone can afford to get to Diamond, though. In theory I have the card power for Diamond, but few of my cards are at mpax level, so I struggle to even get there. The majority of players aren't playing at Diamond or champ as well.
im not i just liek the challege at the top wit hall the cards abilities since i have maxed decks
If the majority dont play it i get the rewards that are larger
At least thats the way i understand it if there is more rewards in diamond 1 and less players more money to me.
can rent a deck for cheap dont need to own them like i do. You can start renting then buying if you want will get ya there faster.
I would like to propose this implementation be limited to Gold League and Below for testing and application purposes initially as this is where Bots are concentrated.
If it fails to address the bot problem then we can implement this to Diamond and Champion League gameplay.
Adding some Economics to strengthen this argument
Wild cards have a lower circulation than the new editions and would have their bonuses impacted and negated at higher tiers. It feels strange to give Alpha and Beta card pack bonuses and then negate them by implementing this change.
For example, in Wild the total print was
300,000 Alpha Packs
900,000 Beta Packs
200,000 Essence Orbs
300,000 Azmare Dice
Compare that to our Modern Format
1,500,000 Untamed Packs
15,000,000 Chaos Legion Packs
3,000,000 Riftwatcher Packs
There have been significantly more packs for Modern than Wild Cards
50X compared to Azmare and Alpha 75X for Essence Orbs and 16.67X for Beta
Modern also provides more rewards per battle than Wild and has consistently since implementation this is also where many bots focus league-wise.
This makes the relatively cheaper editions earn more SPS and drains the pool for new players due to botting while punishing older players who own older edition cards and play in the wild format since they may not have or want to sell out their older edition cards that cannot be played in the modern format.
The main bots are also concentrated in Gold Silver and Bronze Leagues, the argument on Diamond and Champion level bots is rare given the case Modern pays more SPS than Wild per battle at the lower leagues.
The area that concerns me is the need to max out Legendary cards in older sets where it may not make sense and honestly is far more expensive for fewer rewards than the modern format to avoid penalties in Diamond and Champion lv 3 Legendary GF vs lv 2 Alpha or Beta GF would cost 2225 USD at a minimum if you already have one GF card.
This proposal makes sens at lower levels, however, it doesn't make sense to apply it to Diamond and Champion uniformly, I don't see a problem with high-level Bots I see a problem with CP exploits.
Honestly, what needs to happen is draining the players rating slowly when they don't have the required CP (or Power).
That is a huge RED FLAG for people double dipping.
@just2randoms picture in the SPS Dao proposal.
If they don't have the 'Power' for that league then each day their rating is reduced and helps the active players push past them.
I respectfully disagree with the current proposal as I feel there are merits to this at Gold and below where botting is more prevalent.
However, CP costs in Higher Tiers and napping accounts are where the problem lies in Diamond and Champion not botting.
As this proposal stands I don't like the uniform approach that this proposal implies and would like to see it tailored to the lower league gameplay first before applying it to the higher rulesets.
I would vote yes if the proposal impacted Gold League and Below initially
With a separate test if the bots become a larger problem at Diamond and Champion I don't like the overall tradeoffs if Bots are primarily gold and below punishing players who have full sets but have not maxed out every single card just does not make sense to me at the higher leagues.
my bots are diamond 1 and champion lol i guess im the rare one
Yep one bot of the 1025 players if I recall correctly that can play at Champ
And one bot of the 4408 players at Diamond if the stats are still accurate which is a small cute pool for botting :)
So a really rare bot that does not impacts the other
460000 players in Gold and Below give or take a bit since its chilling in its own pool :)
https://peakd.com/splinterlands/@sps.dao/sps-governance-proposal-split-ranked-battle-reward-pools-by-league
A number of players have asked for more data relating the the proposed ranked battle reward changes above. The following table shows the number of unique accounts and % of total SPS earned by league and battle format over the past week (8/24 - 8/31):
Modern Players % of SPS Wild Players % of SPS
Bronze 52,323 1.06% Bronze 141,589 6.44%
Silver 111,212 81.84% Silver 118,704 25.92%
Gold 15,042 13.18% Gold 18,506 38.72%
Diamond 1,601 3.72% Diamond 2,807 17.71%
Champion 202 0.20% Champion 823 11.21%
A lot of those "unique" accounts are playing both formats though. If you check the dashboard on Peakmonsters you can track the Daily Active Users. We're really only around 170-180k average DAU for the past week and who knows how many of those are bots. My guess is at least half
Well Splex made a post they control 40% of the Rental market assuming the other half is Peakmonsters we get the data
GenepoolChlrn8r — 10/13/2022
@everyone
Believe it or not it has been 6 months since we started our journey together. The very first transactions made by what would become affectionately known as the Rent Golem were made on April 13, 2022.
The Rent Golem and this Discord were both publicly launched on April 16th and we’re now up to 2,216 members on Discord and over twice that many rental accounts. I have often said my favorite part of this project is the community of users and the quality of discussions we have on this Discord. Thank you for that!
Now, 6 months later, the Rent Golem is managing over 40% of the rental market in terms of both USD and card volume. This is INCREDIBLE growth far beyond what we hoped for in such a short time. The pace of change has been phenomenal and I wanted to take a moment to outline what all Yixn has been able to accomplish.
Once the Rent Golem was stabilized renting both Modern and Wild Cards (May 19th), Yixn turned his attention to creating tools geared to help those of us managing many accounts. In late May, Fast Sweep and the ability to autoclaim quests and the SPS airdrop brought in lots of new users including many who came for the tools but eventually became Rent Golem users as well.
In Early June, Yixn turned out a couple of tools a week including Reward Lookups (Daily and Seasonal), a Pack Calculator to help us all determine when it was profitable to buy, a ratings graph for our battle history, currency calculators and overall account values all on one overview screen.
During this time we had also been working with the Splinterlands team to get the SPLEX market allowlisted and on June 27th, Yixn published the market with advanced analytics around rental values at different levels and time periods and a cashback program that has proven to be much more rewarding than the leading competitor’s private token.
It was also around this time that we recognized that we had grown beyond just rentals and rebranded as Splinterlands Exchange (SPLEX) to better reflect the breadth of our tools and start to create a hub to support other third party projects.
Our first partnership was with Archmage in early July, where we agreed to provide a market for their tokens and a front end to help streamline their onboarding process. This partnership was highly successful in large part because there are tremendous synergies between our respective user bases. Each project attempts to help players derive yield from their assets in a more hands off way.
After managing some life changes in August, Yixn was able to adjust priorities to make it so that he has been able to focus on SPLEX full time starting in September. This has been extremely apparent by the increased pace of development.
Aside from numerous improvements to the market and other existing tools, we introduced a Referral system in early September and a Riftwatcher pack calculator within a couple of days of the ability to open Riftwatcher packs.
The last few weeks have seen SPLEX add a Missing BCX Buyer to help people complete their desired sets, a Delegation tool to take advantage of a new API introduced by Splinterlands for scholars and bot owners to send staked SPS to other accounts, and Reward Pool Stats to help people determine which league and format are currently the most profitable.
After all of that, we’re ready to announce the biggest new feature SPLEX has seen since the market. I’ll do a separate post to highlight the features, but SPLEX is proud to announce our new Collection Page that solves many of the pain points we continually encountered when trying to use existing solutions.
Thank you so much for those of you who have stuck with us this long (both the service and the length of this post).
Be on the lookout for both the detailed announcement of the Collection Page and an announcement of a Contest and Giveaway to honor our 6 month anniversary.
Only 40% of the rental market? Not to make that seem like any small feat.. I just would've guessed a bit higher than that judging from the number of people always talking about it and recommending it.
I like and use Splex but a part of me can't help but think... if the rental market is constantly being botted and the bots are constantly undercutting other bots for the lowest rental listing... did card prices organically drop or did Splex inadvertently drive them down?
Would not say they did though looking at peakmonsters you can see the last six months of data
https://peakmonsters.com/dashboard
What was more interesting is why daily users dropped May 31st to June 1st
(Its a dramatic fall of half the users/bots?)
That said 176,000 seems to be the real average players over the last month
With card volume and rent pretty consistent overall given the bear market with a big spike 2 weeks ago
That timeframe was the big bot nerf, but that definitely didn't kill all of them. Yeah we've fluctuated a bit since then but from talking to people I know personally, people in my guild, and people on Discord, my guess is the overall decrease in human players is being significantly offset by another increase in bots.
I'll admit rental volume is consistent, but rental prices overall have dipped significantly. Even in my scenario of Bot A undercutting Bot B, who then undercuts Bot C, who undercuts Bot A, who restarts the cycle... the volume still stays the same... it's the overall value taking the hit.
176k can't account for the real average of players when there's at least 2 dozen people I know running 10+ bots each. That's 24 people responsible for 240 accounts and I highly doubt this situation is an outlier.
!BEER
The ECR gameplay change made me move to use the bot services myself so the gameplay change is more of redelegation of ECR vs rent for me.
If they can earn and play and I can throw more games than the 50% ecr cap I'm happy my cards are doing something vs rent, heck if they made a cap of 200 games a day that would do more to quell bots vs humans players, the problem are the self coded bots that don't have 10 to 15 min cooldowns and can do whatever.
On the other hand, I know some players who play all on one account and run below 50% ECR and get penalized for playing a few games without noticing so it led me to keep a few accounts myself at a reasonable level and alternating if I want if I don't feel like it bots run down ECR and getting enough games in :)
Really was getting annoyed as a player when it only recharges 24% a day and with only a few mins a game I can easily finish those in an hour. It's fine if you leave it alone for a few days but it's not that many battles when you're just going at it.
On the other hand, it does make me play more tourneys and brawls, since those can fill in the gaps :) Always like to play a few rounds of regular as a warm-up though before a tourney.
Overall though I agree rent volume may be consistent however, there is a general decrease in players makes sense in crypto winters, it is still higher than it was pre Bullrun I think but it's nowhere near what it was during the bull run.
My group is targeting 1500 accounts but for new players only or middle level there will be a section for some experianced max players but like 2-5% will be that and those are the owners and profit share partners.
View or trade
BEER.Hey @freedomno1, here is a little bit of
BEERfrom @torran for you. Enjoy it!Do you want to win SOME BEER together with your friends and draw the
BEERKING.NFty will be getting some of that pie there services is great ive been testing looking at it and im aalready in business now with them were just aiting to launch
If you spend 85K to get your accounts to bot ujntil diamond or champ so you dont need to play lower leauges i think that sort of investment in a bot is ok bc i clearly supported the game
And is already rewarded in Diamond and Champion as its own pools :)
https://peakd.com/splinterlands/@sps.dao/sps-governance-proposal-split-ranked-battle-reward-pools-by-league
Your arguing for less than 5K players rewards pool vs 460,000 :)
Unless we get some more data that there are more players lurking up there
Im saying do not chop off a high level investors bots thtat have alot per account invested thatis doing somthing good by creating 50 guilds with 1500 scholars to help improve the game. As well as pay myself bc i do need a payout to im a investor not a complete charity but my project will halp many with this.
I like wild better than modern I feel like you win eaier in wild
Ya, I like wild more but it pays less than modern and would cost more to max out at present with a vastly lower card circulation.
It's actually kind of funny since you are a lone bot in the Diamond and Champion leagues it will just cost you more if the bot decides to play a cheap lower than tier level card for some reason against the other 1k players :)
So its a double penalty one for wilds lower rewards and two for bot picking variety if not every single card is maxed out.
I already have it all i guess so i just play there but will have alot of modern fard sooon 12000 packs for a opening and will be giving away cool things if i can get my hads on them.
I have the A bot it does prettyy goood i think there hand picked cards and hasnt worked good in modern for me lol
i personally dont like the idea
I am against it and I will simply summarize it my using other account comment.
"Deck optimization is an art.. team is killing it just because they created oversupply of cards."
A very strong NO.
Did they create a oversupply what happens if GLS players migrate to play SPL to i think GLS will get a larger base and alot will come so there will be demand. And as other games come in on the platform more demand.
Hmmm. This is interesting.
In a good side, players with right collection will be awarded rightfully.
In a bad side, we dont have the resources to level all cards.
Can we just penalize the players with incorrect level if they loss? Because it's thier risk.
Example.
If you win...get the proper reward but if you loss, deduct more so that they loss more.
This will justify players concern if they are skilled.
No thats bs jsut bc i have a higher investment. You have to beat me to win. And I need my money its a investment and a game. Im using alot ofmy money to fund a very useful project to help and bring in new players so abosulutly not
i really dont like this proposal.
I'm a reasonably new player and I dont have all the cards at the right levels. despite that i slog my way through an army of bots, all the way to silver 3. This would literally f*** me over. Why should i get punished for reaching silver with my skill?
I'm trying to build up my deck, ive invested a bit (some 50ish $) and I have some cards but i dont like getting penalized for not having lvl 2 epics/rares and im sure others don't like having to level epics/legendaries that dont need it.
in the same way ecr spanks you if you like to play the game this will stop players from buying single bcx copies to play with and force them to rent maxed copies only.
i play in gold/diamond modern and don't wish to spend $39000 on maxed copies of untamed and $9000 on dice or put money into the game every 2 days to rent them. for this reason i buy at least 1 bcx of all monsters and level key abilities . this will just add to the barrier of entry for new players
Kind of a minor annoyance but why don't these proposals show up under upcoming on the main splinterlands website?
It will eventually.. my guess is they drop them on PeakD first to gauge the response from the community and then, if need be, edit the proposal before making it live in-game for voting
!BEER
Isn't that what upcoming proposals are for
Can't even find SPS Dao unless you look at a previous proposal as info goes to another account lol ....
Usually, just see it when it goes into active
!BEER :)
Oh I totally agree with you... Splinterlands apparently just likes to do things the hard way lol
!PGM
!PIZZA
BUY AND STAKE THE PGM TO SEND A LOT OF TOKENS!
The tokens that the command sends are: 0.1 PGM-0.1 LVL-0.1 THGAMING-0.05 DEC-15 SBT-1 STARBITS-[0.00000001 BTC (SWAP.BTC) only if you have 2500 PGM in stake or more ]
5000 PGM IN STAKE = 2x rewards!
Discord
Support the curation account @ pgm-curator with a delegation 10 HP - 50 HP - 100 HP - 500 HP - 1000 HP
Get potential votes from @ pgm-curator by paying in PGM, here is a guide
I'm a bot, if you want a hand ask @ zottone444
Get on BSC
this does nothing to address a more serious issue: the inability to play your way to a higher level card ownership
It's my contention that players who don't have 50 bucks a week to dump into video games are not going to be able to take advantage of this in any meaningful way and this will further consolidate the rewards into a smaller group of hands. Reward amounts should allow a player who has put in a game console worth of money into Splinterlands to be able to EARN the ability to level up their cards. Currently the value of rewards don't even come close to providing enough value for silver1/gold3 players to move up without spending more money. I have almost 2 years in this game and at least 400 dollars invested (likely more) on top of reinvesting every little bit I make back into the game. I bought packs, individual cards, flipped cards for profit, opened a second grind account that I now use to rent out cards that are not valuable enough to sell but are useless to me because they are outside the modern ruleset. I have a career record of 53.3% on my primary account. I play nearly every day with 18000+ battles total. I believe someone who has put that much into the game should have been able to earn enough to climb to the next rung of the ladder but I still can't even come close to competing in gold let alone beat any of the top 100 silver players. Perhaps this is because I am terrible at this game or perhaps it's because I can't afford to level up every card. But this proposal really creates more problems than it solves and punishes the small time human players.
They would need to start out as a commission player for a large acocunt like mine and earn there cards and eventually go on there own if they want. Also sine my current guilds are lowere level just started i think a good stategy is sending out some powerful decks to leach rewardds from guilds and get mad gladious cards then have it return home and swap it all while leveling my 50 guilds so i can start the plan i have to get more new players a more even shot in brawls
If you play for a high level guild as a scholar you will earn alot more
Lucky i went nuts spent about 85K to do a large project lol
I 100% agree to what you say and it reflects my own journey. I have roughly 30k in CP and I consistently finish around 2000 in rating and stay in Silver 1. I have also bought old packs, new packs, strategic cards (hello Sand worm) etc.
I don't play more than what makes sense from a ECR perspective since I am conscious about the time (there is an alternative cost...) but still probably rakes in 50-60 chests in the new system per season (Daily focus included). The Ranked Rewards change was a huge improvement for me; it made it so much more rewarding (pun intended) to play and get to open a lot of chests. But the thing is, even with this type of reward the actual USD equivalent value is not even close to being able to re-invest in better decks. I think I got like 40 SPS or something last season. That is not even enough to by ONE (1) Riftwatcher pack. If I constantly need to inject real US$ in order to keep "earning" (40 SPS is like 3 USD) I dilute the return on my investment (excluding my time which also has value). That is not Play-to-earn, that is a ponzi scheme.
I am very disappointed in these types of suggestions because it ultimately points to a centralized system, a Rentier society if you will, where the "Rich" owns the assets and the players can rent or are encouraged into "scholarships"; i.e. employed by the asset owners to work/battle. As always things in life are fractal; so what you see here is the same as countless other societies. There are haves and there are have-nots. I started my Splinterlands journey thinking that you could in honesty earn in-game currency which could be re-invested without the cynical approach that you should perpetually be required to invest real-world money over and over again. I have happily committed some 500-1000 USD (including Land) to this because I liked the vision. Now, not so much anymore.
If you join my guild you wont be in silver at all bc we would make sure you have he deck I just made ahuge investment to make sure i have 50000 new cards to delegate to ppl and support scholars. But am i going to get killed here if so i need to pull the plug would hate t odo it bc i really want to do this project.
But ultimately 100K needs to make me money any help the community to
I need to live
Some people have the equivalent of a late model used Honda or a new Hyundai invested and are still barely earning anything lol
and that's the problem- I don't want to earn a bunch of money but I do want the chance to earn my way up the ladder and that's not possible for anything less than buying in at the gold level and even then it's tough
Why not getin with a guild that will give you a gold level deck are ppl charging you in your guild? The way i do it is or am going to once docuemnts are all finalized. is a scholar will ge half of the bot earnigns as well associated withteh account bc i plan on bottting all of them but benefitting my players to. I gotta take care of the team as well. My team will tell you im doing everything I can. I coverd one of my members tuition until they could pay me back which was in a week jsut needed a loan quick. Maybe you are with the wrong ppl. I would be happy to take you on. We have all posiitions open as ere butilding a 1500 person guild
my guild doesn't charge anything and they are relatively ok with donating when you can. We have 2 whales that have really pushed us up the ranks, but we all manage our own decks and coordinate delegations with in the team - it works for me I don't have a lot time for the social side of guild participation
I have maxed cards so if that serves me better couont my vote lol. I dont play with the low level cards for some reason i like maxing it and my bank account is yelling at me for buying all these gold and old cards and a 10K pack chaos buy for my project with the many guilds so i have enough cards to fill them.
Is there any estimate how much more would players that have required card levels earn per league & rank mode? That would help players with lower card levels see if the change would benefit them or not.
For example, if an estimate (based on last season or whatever) is that modern silver league players with required card levels would earn 40% more SPS from ranked battles, then a player that estimated his average penalty will be 80% can see if this change will increase or decrease his earnings.
Sorry if that was mentioned before, figured it would be easier to ask then go through all the comments.
I bought all that stuff to help new players my project will be ment to onboard and support new players with all those cards .
PIZZA Holders sent $PIZZA tips in this post's comments:
@torran(1/10) tipped @freedomno1 (x1)
Join us in Discord!
How about we make proposals that will encourage new players, not make it harder for new players?
Or why not a project like mine i will make money and i do bot at a high level but im sharing my rewards with my team i make sure they have the cards they need to play what they want and givethem the freedom to do what they do I dont micro manage just ask me for what you need in my guild see what happens. I know many dont run this way but I try and take care of my team and if you want you are morethan welcome
This seems a bit off for me.
So this update seems to punish skilled players who can get more done with lower level cards.
I find myself using quite often some level 3-4 (common & rare) Chaos legion cards in my Diamond league gameplay.
This could encourage people to level up their cards but I think ultimately nobody will care that much and the bots will just rent the gap cards they need and that'll be that. Maybe get rid of the starter cards altogether? Or new accounts can use them for 1 season and that's it.
Throwing a bit of the data from the R-share calculations on card-level-rewards from the discord.
From talans view in the r-share chat
This is the problem with this proposal. The narrative has been "the pools will get bigger so everyone wins". The data does not support the gold pool getting bigger at all, the silver pool will get a little bigger(At an absolutely MAXIMUM it would be 30%, but 15% is more likely since it's less of a penalty in silver).
There is no "1 bcx army draining gold rewards", it is not a thing, period. 95% of rewards in gold are captured by level-appropriate summoners.
The data also supports that playing underleveled cards, even in just silver, is already not very rewarding
Average rshares per win in silver for an r3 summoner - 1800
average rshares per win in silver for an r1 summoner - 327
But I will also admit that: this will have virtually no effect on real players either, the chickens/fiends will mostly come out in the wash
The stated goals of this proposal: remove under-leveled cards from draining rewards + incentivize combing cards. I don't see how either goal is accomplished here
I think both are worthy goals
I feel like this will have a minimal impact on anyone as most play in bronze and silver. It doesn't really start to have much effect until gold and I feel like it impacts/punishes the better players the most. We have a guild mate who can push into diamond with a silver level deck but he also usually takes a top ranking in silver leaderboards or places high in tourneys and brawls etc. This will impact him the most. I think the problems lay in the matchmaker system and rating systems and this is a lazy attempt to address those issues without addressing those issues.
what about FURIOUS CHICKEN ，Using this card(Lv0) means less reward ? There is no doubt that when the input is not proportional to the output, the overall price of the old cards will fall，seems like a harvesting of old players
so i have a dumb question, is this % card level calc in addition to the existing % calc based on ECR, so like % ECR x % card level is the proposed way of calculating shares or the proposal is not accounting for ECR anymore and just card levels?
In my opinion the main issue that plagues Splinterlands players in the lower leagues are the bot accounts. It is very easy to create an AI that plays Splinterlands way better than any real player could. The game has simple set rules and the AI developers can calculate exactly which chance to win one set of cards has against another. Especially beginners who are just getting their feet wet in the game stand no chance against all the mathematically optimized AI opponents.
When I went on holiday a few weeks ago, I decided to rent out almost my complete collection and only kept low level cards that weren't worth renting out.
The weather was bad, so I decided to play some SL on bronze just for fun.
(I can only encourage anyone to repeat this experiment, it will open your eyes)
TLDR: It was NOT fun at all! Extremely frustrating!
I usually end the season in higher gold / lower diamond. This time, I began the season in lower bronze and even descended into novice for a short time until I slowly managed to climb into silver with the help of some stronger cards (a single Kron in your deck works wonders btw.).
But even in silver all I face are still lv1 summoners with lv1 monsters. Most of the time not even a single lv2 monster.
After going through all this trouble I opened my 10 daily hard earned bronze chests: Not a single card inside. This is going to kill SL in the long run. New players need to have fun and get a reward, especially when they have to fight hard to achieve something.
Personally I'd rather vote for this proposal:
-> Only allow bot accounts for a limited period of time when players need to wait more than 30 sec to find an opponent in their current league. If ranks are full, they are full.
Bots may have been necessary in the early days of SL when there were not enough players for match making but now they became just leeches draining money from new players.
Just my 2 cent.
Ya 50 credits for a 2-day rental of Kron would help a lot we're playing in Gimp mode imagine it as a nub with 3K credits total assuming they cannot recharge at all unless they earn SPS or DEC.
The minimum purchase is 1000 Credit blocks so they are quite a distance from that and then push it up to a Silver
Once they run out of starter credits they hopefully have a few cards otherwise they just lost their real chance at the game.
What about staking to rent? like you stake hp to rent x deck i get to vote the HP how ever i want during that time.
What is the incentive under the following structure:
League Common Rare Epic Legendary
Bronze 1 1 1 1
Silver 3 2 2 1
Gold 5 4 3 2
Diamond 8 6 5 3
Champion MAX MAX MAX MAX
For a player with cards of sufficient level for Silver to move into Gold.
If a deck contained one of each rarity...
In Silver they would get (3/3 + 2/2 + 2/2 + 1/1) / 4 = (1 + 1 + 1 + 1) /4 = 100%
In Gold they would get (3/5 + 2/4 {1/2} + 2/3 + 1/2) / 4 = (0.6 + 0.5 + 0.66 + 0.5) = 57%
Surely this is an incentive for players to stay down a league and maximise returns.
I get that more total rewards could be available in Gold as opposed to Silver so it might even itself out, however, who is going to take that chance?
The original chart repeated for easy cross reference
League Common Rare Epic Legendary
Bronze 1 1 1 1
Silver 3 2 2 1
Gold 5 4 3 2
Diamond 8 6 5 3
Champion MAX MAX MAX MAX
Wouldn't the following chart be better?
League Common Rare Epic Legendary
Min Max Min Max Min Max Min Max
Bronze 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1
Silver 1 3 1 2 1 2 1 1
Gold 3 5 2 4 2 3 1 2
Diamond 5 8 4 6 3 5 2 3
Champion 8 Max 6 Max 5 Max 3 Max
This way each player gets a bonus for each card they have that is between the low level and the high level for their league. Allowing for gradual growth and progression into the next league, rather than cliff edges between the leagues.
Eg: if a player moves from Silver to Gold League and owns all max level cards for Silver and plays one of each lowest cards for each rarity for Gold as follows from the proposed table:
3, 2, 2, 1 = (3/3 + 2/2 + 2/2 + 1/1) / 4 = (1 + 1 + 1 + 1) /4 = 100%
as they grow their collection they will get to max level cards for each rarity in Gold:
5, 4, 3, 2 = (5/3 + 4/2 + 3/2 + 2/1) / 4 = (1.66 + 2 + 1.5 + 2) / 4 = 179%
This will allow a player to grow organically into their next league without feeling like they are being penalised for having lower-level cards if they advance a league.
Hope it makes sense, it did to me :)
This is really bad! we need to see the player base growing not decreaseing!
I HOPE the whales see that and change their vote, WE ARE HERE FOR THE LONG RUN! Doesnt matter if you will earn alot sps or cards if no one is intrested in play the game...
And why should i lvl cards that i dont want to see them leveled?! like FIENDS, CHICKEN, STONEFISH, and even some good cards are great without leveling them, this is just not a solution to deal with the bots... and doesnt matter if they can just rent lvled cards from the market, ya becouse they will be cheap for sure if the player base doesnt grow!!!!
Actually this goes aganist the fun and essence of the game.
This tottaly says "doesnt matter if you are good in the game, you need to have the cards levelled or you will be penalize, and ya we did that couse we cant do nothing aganist bots..." are you sure you wanna play this game?
Полный шлак. То есть игра ничего не дает, только ожидает донаты. Умение играть нивелируется, главное побольше карт арендовать. Какой тогда стимул играть? Я против!
Can't believe this will pass ... so stupid. Why force someone to up a card if the level up is useless for what he want to do
Its not you dont have to but overall why would we ant to reward ppl for not investing in the game just saying .
Maybe lower the req a bit like a lever or two down for higher leauges
I guess the result of this proposal is the majority of players will get less daily and season reward chests... As not many players will have every card in their deck at the required level for their league. For example: I may only see a 20% reduction in reward shares, as I have quite a few cards at the right level, but someone with lower level cards in my league will see a bigger reduction in r shares, maybe >50%. The result may be that sps chests are worth more as less are given out?! but there will also be less reward cards etc... will be interesting to see how it works out.
Cant the shares be delegated thats what i would do to solve this on my tema
Hay que pensar en los nuevos jugadores y esta propuesta no les viene bien, queremos que entren nuevos jugadores y que sea mas fácil jugar y ganar recompensas para ellos. además el pollo y las demás criaturas de coste cero noson necesarios subirles de nivel, y al usarlos perdemos recompensas.
¡ YO VOTO NO !
so many adjustment made because of bot what if remove the bots from the system?
The shittiest idea ever
I have voted against this proposal.
In my opinion, it will create a cliff edge at every league boundary, causing players to decide to stay down a league until they upgrade all their cards to the correct level for the next league.
The cost of moving from Bronze to Silver will be achievable for a small $ investment, from Silver to Gold the cost will be exponentially higher and I cannot see me ever achieving moving into Diamond after this update.
I don't have the financial resources to instantly level my Common and Rare Chaos Legion cards to max for Gold League, let alone the Untamed ones. As a Wild player, I would also need to level cards from all sets.
So after this proposal is implemented it is Silver I for me and I have never had a pack drop in a Silver chest.
SPS for land has only just been rolled out, and yet the Land release date is consistently pushed back in favour of Projects that generate new revenue for Splinterlands.
The rental market of lvl 3 Common and lvl 2 Rare Chaos Legion cards has collapsed already, after this update I can see a further impact, destroying my income stream that assisted me in upgrading my collection. The first nail in the rental coffin was implementing enforced 2 day rentals in my opinion.
I am already re-evaluating this game and where it is going, so far it looks like anyone with a collection that doesn't meet the level requirements for Diamond League might as well throw in the towel now.
In my opini
Or go play for them and get to the level by earning with there deck and a split
Seeing this will likely pass heres a tip to real players
Skip the summoners with your starting credits 3000 is to few unless you want to buy a lv 1 Sloan Djinn Renova Gargoya Lion combo
1 Djinn Oshanus owned or rented will push you past the bots to a decent bronze after the novice wall.
1 Kron lv 1 rented for 2 days could do the trick as well
Cheat the rewards by buying the cheap GF reward cards
Spam Gargoya Lion the Neutral GF for chests at higher Bronze at 200 Credits worth it
After that probally sit around 400 Bronze and be able to earn bronze season chests at a decent pace and a micro sum of SPS
Rent the rest and try to keep the remaining credits alive
Best of luck
!BEER
!PIZZA
@freedomno1, sorry! You need more to stake more $PIZZA to use this command.
The minimum requirement is 20.0 PIZZA staked.
More $PIZZA is available from Hive-Engine or Tribaldex
doesn't this make it a pay to win game then?!?!
Dont you pay for evey game at least in these you can sell out at a profit or a loss but you can sell out not like trading in games for 1/100 of the cost at a store
High level cards are better than low level cards. Using them increases win-rate, and therefore amount of rewards. Because of the Capture Rate players with low win-rate can not receive many rewards. I don't see the problem, that this proposal tries to solve.
Please vote no. The nerfing of low level and older cards is bad enough as newer stronger cards are released. Now this incentive would make the older weaker cards have even less value to a deck. This just funnels more value to the few that play at the higher levels. Enough already, keep the reward distribution wider by allowing even lower level cards fair share. People that want to achieve the highest level will have incentive enough. No need to reduce the share of reward to lower (cheap) cards.
My guess is there is a plan to add value as the older players hav tues akd there will be a use case added. Just givethem a chance to work.
I bet something comes out to make old cards more valuable again jsut wait. There is no way ppl want that in the long run especially og players with alot of influance.
Speaking as someone who will be largely unaffected by this I think its a poor proposal that is only going to stunt growth. You need to consider new players and keep the game accessible and worthwhile playing for them or you all you will be left with is whales and bot farm owners who can still do well due to sheer volume of accounts.
I have bots but that funds my project that helps new players so what do you do with that? I also need a ROI and deverve it with my investment. would you invest alot of money expecting nor roi fuck no
There is no way a person like me should bd penlaisd[ for botting high level accounts to fund a new player and kick start threm hne i started i leared fo
I never said you should be penalised, quite the opposite in fact as farming bots will still be profitable. Maybe read the comment before ranting in your replies.
It must have been late my bad sorry i was woozy
I retract my comment lol
We deffinately need to have new player experiance eased and a way to keepthe leeching out so im all for trying it and seeing .
Im all for this I bot but have high level bots so wont do antthing to me just give me more
example 1's graphics indicates bronze league, not silver as indicated by the text. likewise, it uses a level 3 common, not a level 5 common. this might induce confusion
I think it will help ppl incentivise getting more cards and not pushish maxed decks with price decreases as they level like me. Was initially against it but swapped my vot of 500K sps to support it as it will end up with higher battle rewards for me and a incentive to get the f out of bronze farming or something I farm with a bot at over a million CP so thats not a issue its like playing a real person and i have alot of cards on it so i let it earn 24/7 sucking in rewards to fund my other projects here and pay me to. If im in diamaond or champ it sounds like i can make more loot so why not
Rift watchers should shoot up if this happens there is so little supply
i look at gold rift and see 100 circulation for super cheap im buying those alot lol lets see if it pays off
This proposal sucks and it's making a lot of people quit right now. Great job guys. I've had to convivence two people this week to not sell their entire collection this week...